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-   -   ESA Bullying, Where do I stand(legally)? (https://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum/o-ss-drivers-general-software/10433-esa-bullying-where-do-i-stand-legally.html)

ChuckleBrother September 29, 2008 06:00 PM

ESA Bullying, Where do I stand(legally)?
 
So recently my Rogers email got a message from the company(Rogers) that the ESA wanted my internet connection shut down. According to them I was trying to pirate Company of Heroes(pictured below, a game I already own:))

So basically, where do I stand legally here? I mean, I ALREADY own the game, I just couldn't find my discs so I dled a backup so I didn't need to hunt through my ~300 cd/dvd collection to find Disc 2. Do they have any actual clout or can I just rest easy?

Proofs!
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b2...IMG_0028-1.jpg

Cptn Vortex September 29, 2008 06:15 PM

Wow thats a joke. Just say your router is unlocked and someone else must have downloaded it

Jack Rabbit September 29, 2008 06:37 PM

This is very disturbing. We have not seen this in Canada before. I would suspect it is a scam. It is dead easy to lie about the return address of an e-mail. Contact Rogers via another channel and verify the claim.

If you do talk to Rogers you need to be very careful. Do not make any statements or claims. Simply request their accusation and terms. Nothing you can say will make it better in a court of law.

If this is for real you need to find the quickest way out or dig in for a lengthy legal battle. Either way you need to start by getting a lawyer. IANAL but there is no legal precedent here and the ESA has a zillion times more money than you and they can make your life miserable.

If this is rely coming from Rogers you could spread the word in as many forums and arenas you can. This will probably be risky for you but it might hit the news or collect some popular resistance.

Jon_di2 September 29, 2008 06:38 PM

I have actually worked for an anti-piracy company (not for games), but it sounds sketchy to me... Yes they do get screenshots of IP addresses of people downloading files, however their main concern is not people downloading. The cost of building a legal case is too high to try and get the downloaders. It is the people uploading, but more importantly those who run the ftp websites.

Also they legally can't ask Rogers to cancel your internet service, they would have to take you to court and prove beyond resonable dout that it was in fact you who downloaded the copy of the game. Even then, this would not effect Rogers providing you with internet service.

So the e-mail you received probably isn't from Rogers.

enaberif September 29, 2008 06:42 PM

post the email.

ChuckleBrother September 29, 2008 07:13 PM

I really do hope its a scam, I really really do:

Code:

Hash: SHA1

Entertainment Software Association
575 7th Street, NW, Suite 300
Washington, DC 20004 USA

Attention:  Intellectual Property Enforcement
Telephone:  202-223-2400
E-mail:  mailto:esa@copyright-compliance.com?subject=RE%3A%20Notice%20ID%3A%20182%2D57799504%20ESA%20Canada%20Notice

27 Sep 2008 17:14:03 GMT


ISP: Rogers Cable Communications Inc.
ESA Reference Number: 182-57799504


Dear Rogers Cable Communications Inc.:

The Entertainment Software Association (ESA) is a trade association that represents the intellectual property interests of numerous companies that publish interactive games for video game consoles, personal computers, handheld devices and the Internet in the United States of America, in Canada, and in other countries (collectively referred to as ESA members).  ESA is authorized to act on behalf of ESA members whose copyright and other intellectual property rights it believes to be infringed as described herein.

ESA is providing this letter of notification to make Rogers Cable Communications Inc. aware of material on its network or system that infringes the exclusive copyright rights of and is unlawful towards one or more ESA members.

ESA members are entitled to the full protection of Canadian intellectual property laws, including the Copyright Act, R.S.C. 1985, c. C-42, as amended, in such entertainment software products. 

Based on the information at its disposal on 25 Sep 2008 20:41:53 GMT, ESA has a good faith belief that 72.138.3.99 infringes the rights of one or more ESA members by offering for sale or download unauthorized copies of game products protected by copyright, or offering for sale or download material that is the subject of infringing activities.  The copyrighted works that have been infringed include but are not limited to:

Title: Company of Heroes
Infringement Source: BitTorrent
Infringement Timestamp: 25 Sep 2008 20:41:53 GMT
Infringement Last Documented: 25 Sep 2008 20:41:53 GMT
Infringer Username:
Infringing Filename: Company of heroes opposing fronts [PC-DVD] [English] [www.topetorrent.com]
Infringing Filesize: 8325001242
Infringer IP Address: 72.138.3.99
Infringer DNS Name: cpe001cf0713a13-cm001692564986.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com
Infringing URL: http://a.tracker.thepiratebay.org/announce


The unauthorized copies of such game product(s) or the material that is the subject of infringing activities appears on or is made available through 72.138.3.99.  Those items are listed and/or identified thereon by their titles or variations thereof, game-related listings/references/descriptions, or depictions of game-related artwork.  Such copies, titles, game-related listings/references/descriptions, depictions, and material that is the subject of infringing activities, are hereinafter referred to as "Infringing Material." 

Accordingly, ESA hereby requests Rogers Cable Communications Inc. to immediately do the following:

1.    Notify the account holder of the Infringing Material.
2.    Remove, or disable access to, the Infringing Material detailed above.
3.    Take appropriate action against the account holder under your Abuse Policy/Terms
    of Service Agreement, including termination of a repeat offender.

Please inform us whether you will remove or disable access to the Infringing Material as requested.  Rogers Cable Communications Inc. or the account holder may contact ESA at the above-listed contact details, with email preferred.  Please include the above-noted Reference Number in the subject line of all email correspondence.

Thank you for your cooperation and prompt response in this matter.

Sincerely,

Intellectual Property Enforcement
Entertainment Software Association

Note that they didn't want Rogers to remove my service, but if Rogers DOES follow through, their policy in cases like this(as stated on their site) is to cancel service.

If someone can confirm this as a definite scam, I will send you a box of cookies(damn good ones too).

Infiniti September 29, 2008 07:43 PM

On that email, it lists the address as the US ESA office, but shouldn't it list the Canadian one?

Which is this:
Entertainment Software Association of Canada
130 Spadina Ave, Suite 408
Toronto, ON M5V 2L4


Plus, I doubt they can do much to you, have a look at this dugg article: Digg - Canadian Police Tolerates Piracy For Personal Use

Cheator September 29, 2008 07:53 PM

Relax, these are very common. Some ISPs ignore them, some forward them to the user, but none disconnected (I can't tell you what my company does). The ISP I work for gets these alot from these guys and others. So ignore it.

As for your legality, you broke the EULA by getting a copy of the disc even though you own it, which really isn't law. But depending on how you did it, you probably broke the law. Any uploading from P2P is illegal, so torrents etc.

enaberif September 29, 2008 07:54 PM

What email client do you use?

enaberif September 29, 2008 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cheator (Post 94157)
Relax, these are very common. Some ISPs ignore them, some forward them to the user, but none disconnected (I can't tell you what my company does). The ISP I work for gets these alot from these guys and others. So ignore it.

As for your legality, you broke the EULA by getting a copy of the disc even though you own it, which really isn't law. But depending on how you did it, you probably broke the law. Any uploading from P2P is illegal, so torrents etc.

Sorry Torrents are not illegal. There a hundreds of uses for torrents that are perfectly legal, its all in how the end user uses them.


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