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Old July 26, 2010, 10:48 PM
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Default Another loop order, single/dual loop thread...

I know this has been beat to death on many forums but I really do need help with this.

I have been building up my hardware for my dream rig, and it has been a marathon to be honest. About a year ago I had Charles do me up an inverted ATX Murdermod and every time I think I have the hardware I want or the money to do it, luck has not been on my side.

Now I think I am good to go, except for exactly how to go about it as I have a few choices and very little room to maneuver after I pull the trigger. The reason I am stuck is because of the luminous panel that has to be precision tapped by the craftsman that builds it. I have a template that must be marked exactly and has quite a large turnaround time as it is made and tapped in Europe. So I want to really be confidant in my choice.

So, here is my hardware to date.

Rampage III Extreme
Intel 980x
12GB Corsair Cas8 2000 Dom GT
EVGA GTX 480 or XFX 5870 ref (havent decided yet which one)
Corsair HX 1000
Crucial C300 256GB (think I will grab another)
Pioneer BD-R (cant remember the model number, Charles powder coated it for me)
Auzen Hometheater HD
Mcubed BigNG


Watercooling

HK 3.0 Vernickelt
EK FC5870 Plexi/Nickel
EK-FB RE3 Acetal/Nickel
Feser quad X-Changer
Feser single X-Changer (also have a dual laying around)
3x DDC-2
2x EK Multioption RES 100
Wheelbarrow full of Bitspower fittings
If I decide to use the GTX 480 I will grab an EK Plexi/Nickel FC block
I have an EK Dual DDC Turbo Top, but think I will stay away from it. I have some older Petras tops that I amy switch out for some new EK V2s
PC Pro LRT 3/8" in red/white/black (haven't decided colors yet)


Now my question finally. I asked it on XS but they hate Feser to much to respond so I thought I could count on my fellow Canadians to help a brother out. Should I go with a super loop with the quad and single rad, or should I seperate the CPU/GPU on the quad from the NB/SB/Mosfet single rad? If I go single loop that saves another set of taps in the luminous panel, and some complexity on the entire build as I could shed a res as well. I am leaning towards a dual loop myself as I am an oldschooler, and have always wanted to maximize efficiency, but the new way seems to be superlooping. Just not sure enough to go either way and need some swaying

I also want to send a huge thanks to a few peeps. First is Zsamz_ for helping me amass some of the hardware. Has always been a good guy to me and over a period of several years. Just seems like a guy that can always be counted on

The other goes to Dazmode. Super duper great service and I even got a Christmas card! My last order arrived today and was packaged better than any I have ever gotten. Looked like it was done in a factory and it showed up a hell of a lot faster than I thought.

Edit: Dayum. I forgot a couple others. Charles Harwood for sure. The guy is a machine and one of the most sincere people I have ever met. And also BlueAqua from XS. Super neat and helped me with getting some hardware from the States. Another straight up dude.

Just wanted to say thanks to you guys

Also a thanks to anyone that takes time to respond. :)
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Last edited by turtletrax; July 27, 2010 at 10:37 PM.
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Old July 27, 2010, 09:47 AM
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I'd go with one single loop myself, just to reduce the plumbing going through the light plate.
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Old July 27, 2010, 11:38 AM
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Single-loop gets my vote.

Similar to how everyone kind of went nuts over excessive radiator area in recent years, the multi-loop phenomenon is another instance of a lot of people doing it for the bling, and then trying to fabricate reasons afterwards. It's not more efficient than single-loop, and it's not more effective. It also tends to take up more space in a case, and splitting two pumps across two loops removes a level of redundancy. In its defense, it may make future modifications easier in that you only have to take apart one smaller loop, and it gives you the option of deliberately sacrificing cooling on one component, in order to focus it on another component, which in rare circumstances, may actually be beneficial.

In your situation, I'd personally rather have that extra single rad helping out on the CPU/GPU, especially if you're planning on some fairly heavy overclocking. Once you got it on water, the chipset thermals tend to be pretty binary - either it's stable or it isn't, and a degree or two doesn't make any difference. And put together in a single loop, I would probably expect the single rad to do more work than it would if only had the chipset to handle.

The caveat to this that I would offer is if the single rad is getting preheated air (from the quad rad) - in that case, the single is likely doing squat, and you may as well get it and the accompanying chipset out of the way entirely, so that the preheated air only affects the chipset (and likely won't have any effect, as mentioned above).
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Old July 27, 2010, 02:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SugarJ View Post
I'd go with one single loop myself, just to reduce the plumbing going through the light plate.
Pretty much what I was thinking, but old habits die hard. LOL

How is your Murdermod holding up?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MpG View Post
Single-loop gets my vote.

Similar to how everyone kind of went nuts over excessive radiator area in recent years, the multi-loop phenomenon is another instance of a lot of people doing it for the bling, and then trying to fabricate reasons afterwards. It's not more efficient than single-loop, and it's not more effective. It also tends to take up more space in a case, and splitting two pumps across two loops removes a level of redundancy. In its defense, it may make future modifications easier in that you only have to take apart one smaller loop, and it gives you the option of deliberately sacrificing cooling on one component, in order to focus it on another component, which in rare circumstances, may actually be beneficial.

In your situation, I'd personally rather have that extra single rad helping out on the CPU/GPU, especially if you're planning on some fairly heavy overclocking. Once you got it on water, the chipset thermals tend to be pretty binary - either it's stable or it isn't, and a degree or two doesn't make any difference. And put together in a single loop, I would probably expect the single rad to do more work than it would if only had the chipset to handle.

The caveat to this that I would offer is if the single rad is getting preheated air (from the quad rad) - in that case, the single is likely doing squat, and you may as well get it and the accompanying chipset out of the way entirely, so that the preheated air only affects the chipset (and likely won't have any effect, as mentioned above).
Edit: I was reading wrong LOL. The bolded stuff above is exactly what has me confused. The chipset really doesn't need great cooling, but definitely needs active cooling as the Murdermod has poor airflow on the top mobo portion of the case. Still torn as what to do...

Looks like I am stuck with dual loop as far as I can tell.
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Old July 27, 2010, 03:51 PM
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What I mean is that when the air goes through one radiator, it warms up (because it's carrying away the heat from the water). If the warm air goes through a second radiator afterwards, it won't be as effective. In fact, if both radiators are on the same loop, the radiator getting the warmed-up air often does absolute squat, especially with lower-speed fans. So if that's how the radiators are going to be positioned in your case, than I can't see a lot of point in adding the single-rad to the main loop, that's all.
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Old July 27, 2010, 03:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MpG View Post

The caveat to this that I would offer is if the single rad is getting preheated air (from the quad rad) - in that case, the single is likely doing squat, and you may as well get it and the accompanying chipset out of the way entirely, so that the preheated air only affects the chipset (and likely won't have any effect, as mentioned above).
Quote:
Originally Posted by turtletrax View Post
Edit: I was reading wrong LOL. The bolded stuff above is exactly what has me confused. The chipset really doesn't need great cooling, but definitely needs active cooling as the Murdermod has poor airflow on the top mobo portion of the case. Still torn as what to do...

Looks like I am stuck with dual loop as far as I can tell.
I think what MPG is getting at is that if your single rad sits where it's getting warm air from the quad it might be better off in a separate loop elsewhere.

Quote:
Originally Posted by turtletrax View Post
Pretty much what I was thinking, but old habits die hard. LOL

How is your Murdermod holding up?
Still a thing of beauty. My only regret is not going BTX so you can see the GPU block better.
Here's the current iteration, with a 470 and the mobo block in place.
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Old July 27, 2010, 10:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MpG View Post
What I mean is that when the air goes through one radiator, it warms up (because it's carrying away the heat from the water). If the warm air goes through a second radiator afterwards, it won't be as effective. In fact, if both radiators are on the same loop, the radiator getting the warmed-up air often does absolute squat, especially with lower-speed fans. So if that's how the radiators are going to be positioned in your case, than I can't see a lot of point in adding the single-rad to the main loop, that's all.
Ya, I was basically agreeing with your train of thought. If the Single is doing no good in the superloop no point being there at all. I am still wrestling with the chipset loop. I have two kids that run me ragged or I would just test it out I think if I go with 5870 I will do a single loop and GTX480 will go with dual loop. Just need to decide now...

Leaning towards the 480.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SugarJ View Post
I think what MPG is getting at is that if your single rad sits where it's getting warm air from the quad it might be better off in a separate loop elsewhere



Still a thing of beauty. My only regret is not going BTX so you can see the GPU block better.
Here's the current iteration, with a 470 and the mobo block in place.
Looks awesome Sugar Some builds I hate big tubing and others look amazing. Yours is definitely the latter Hope to get my build looking as sweet!

Thanks guys. Will get to work and hope it turns out great.
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Old July 28, 2010, 05:01 PM
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Good job grbbing a murderMod Turtle! I'm waiting on my sLight, and have been for ever lol.
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Old July 28, 2010, 08:40 PM
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Bip-Bip! Need to add more c00lant into res.
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