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  #21 (permalink)  
Old June 11, 2009, 04:40 PM
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Not had too many issues with the swiftech tubing with hydrx in the last year-a little bit clouded. I found the musky tubing did cloud a bit more, but that may have been something to do with using 2 GPU blocks and not flushing my thermochill PA120.3 when I got it. Will have to keep things squeeky clean for the feser red and my new EK X58 blockset.
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Old June 11, 2009, 04:50 PM
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Ok, well since I Know a thing or two about chemistry I'm going to tell you straight up its not the fluoride.

Fluoride like to react with hydrogen and the alkali metals, i.e lithium, sodium potassium, etc etc.
It also reacts with calcium, albeit very slowly, hence why it is in toothpaste.

Anyways, I get cloudy tubing as well, and after cutting the tubing apart and wiping it off with my finger I've come to conclude that it is a sediment. a very fine grained white powder. This leads me to believe that it is a salt of some kind. Perhaps it is calcium chloride. Since montreal's water is non-fluorinated, and all of your water is chlorinated (to a very small degree, if you dont believe me, leave a glass of water out for a day or two and taste it. It will taste like swimming pool water). Also, no matter how hard we try, the water we take from anywhere (even distilled water) has a small amount of dissolved substance. Calcium is a very small molecule (relatively) and can easily fit beween the hydrogen bonds in water. Nothing short of taking raw hydrogen and combining it with raw oxygen will get rid of it.

If you want to try to get rid of it yourself, the best way I see it is to use chemical reactions.

To physically remove calcium, It has to be turned into a salt, and allowed to precipitate. get some fluoride or iodine and try to make the salts calcium fluorite and calcium iodate. Then distill the solution to get rid of a large amount of the dissolved salts.

OR buy colored tubing (I use primochill UV green)
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Old June 11, 2009, 05:28 PM
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Why then does this sediment not stick to the side of the distilled bottle in Shopper's Drug Mart? Wouldn't it be white or opaque as well? Is it the same reason why it does not stick to my res (EK 250mm rev 2) and only the tubes? Perhaps the acrylic and plastic are too polished for it to stick....Hmmmm

Here is a pic of vinegar used in a BIX rad and poured out again in a glass bowl. Slightly blue due to the breakdown of the copper a little but the opaqueness is still there.


Yeah I am thinking coloured tubing as well at the moment but still want to do some tests and share the info.

***Thinking to himself.....just lean out and jingle keys.....doh, no keys....wave a flag like an idiot*** ***That should distract them***
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Old June 11, 2009, 05:32 PM
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The only tubing I've ever had that didn't cloud was some Masterkleer stuff, which went about five months and was still fresh and clean. Other than that, every batch of Tygon 3603 that I've used has gone cloudy within a month or two. I'm finally making the switch to Primochill, but since I'm using the black stuff, guess it'll be a moot point.

There are also different kinds of "Cloudy". Technically speaking, precipitate on the inside of the tubing is cloudiness, and while your theory might well be correct Cowboy, the other big culprit is flux from radiators. Thermochills are horribly notorious for this - I've finally got my three PA120.3's clean after about 15 distilled water flushes - but even other rads will often have a little flux left over from the process.
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Old June 11, 2009, 05:45 PM
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Never used Masterkleer myself but hear people say the same thing about it that it took awhile longer. Maybe I should just run a hose to my fill port and clamp it on and open both drains and just go nuts with the hot water for a couple days. Maybe that will get rid of everything.
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Old June 11, 2009, 06:33 PM
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Well in my loop the 3 gpu blocks and the NB/SB blocks had been used for about 2 months. The 2 swiftech rads, pump, cpu block are all new. I'm running 90/10 mix of water/coolant.
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Old June 11, 2009, 09:01 PM
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Hey, thats why its called a theory. It has yet to be proven and is based solely on hypothesis and conjecture.

I look forward to tests as well, I want to know whats going on here.
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Old June 15, 2009, 02:07 PM
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Well I did not take pics yet but I will and edit this post tonight. But the test here is going to reflect what 'Brodholm' is doing on XS but with a twist and more testing for the correction as well. His test is here -> Tubing and clouding, Ongoing mini test! - XtremeSystems Forums

My test that I will be doing is different to examine the different possibilities discussed here. He has his with Distilled, Distilled with silver and Distilled with PT-Nuke PHN additive. I will be doing the same but with a bigger length of Tygon R3603 tubing since it seems to be more susceptible to the clouding. I will be doing;

1) Distilled only as a control

2) Distilled with PT Nuke PHN as well as a comparative to his test as many think it is this as the problem.

3) Will be taking fluid shaken from a rad with distilled only

4) Will be taking fluid shaken from a rad with distilled and PT Nuke PHN

5) Will be (just ordered it so it will be the last test done) hooking up a Pentek clear housing water filter with a 5 micron sediment filter cartridge to see if it cleans up the loop as a test to see if it is indeed sediment and to find where it is coming from.

Hopefully after this is done we can finally identify what is making the tubing clouded and to take safe guards against it by educating the water cooling community and to update all the water cooling guides to include that information.
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Last edited by Sadasius; June 15, 2009 at 02:13 PM.
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Old June 15, 2009, 06:50 PM
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After three months Tygon looks absolutely disgusting: kind of yellowish, dirty crap... Need find time replace this.
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Old June 17, 2009, 10:16 AM
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Well here are some of the photos taken quickly. Now I am warning you I am not a damn photographer by any means.

Here are some of the test subjects.....Self explanatory.


Here is a pic of the filter attached to Black Phoenix.


Tube in one of the test containers.


What the top of the filter looks like.


This filter is large enough. I was actually shocked by the size of it. The filter is an awesome filter too and will filter out any impurities in the water. This is a pic of it running.


Here is a pic to show it running if you look at the res and see the air bubbles.


I will report things on a weekly basis on this test to see if there is any improvement on the filter system or the tube situation in the different liquid solutions.
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Last edited by Sadasius; January 6, 2010 at 03:20 PM. Reason: spelling and grammar because I am retarded! :)
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