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-   -   A Closer Look at AMD's Mantle (Comment Thread) (http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum/video-cards/63430-closer-look-amds-mantle-comment-thread.html)

SKYMTL September 30, 2013 08:29 PM

A Closer Look at AMD's Mantle (Comment Thread)
Is it possible to make developing for the PC easier? That's the question AMD's Mantle hopes to answer. In this article we take a quick look at the technology and its possible far-reaching implications.

Read more here: http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum...ds-mantle.html

Astaroth October 1, 2013 12:08 AM

Mantle means not only AMD has a firmer grasp of the console market, but also on certain pc cross platform titles. Is NVIDIA stuck with licensing Mantle? How will it render if you aren't using AMD?

Dzzope October 1, 2013 12:28 AM

It's DX compatible API, it should still work regardless but with added performance / options for the devs to optimize better for GCN cards.

If mantle is widely adopted, then yea, they will have a very firm grip of the console market and make huge bounds in PC too. But that's a big if.
They also have to keep the support level high and have a quality non-buggy product.. which to me they haven't proved they can do in some time.

Nvidia won't be able to license it unless they totally re-design their architecture. It relies on the hardware.

trodas October 1, 2013 12:34 AM

Now it makes perfect sense, why suddently nVidia is releasing the specs of their chips, so something similar could be done with their HW too. They must undoubtely know, what huge performance increase this approach can gain (not just faster Draw Calls, but mainly unlocking the parallel multicores rendering give AND CPU's finally a way where they could shine and outclass some Intel models).

Let's hope the BF4 will be optimized enought (it will be the first Manthe game, before xmass) to show the true potencial of the AMD hardware and surprise us with serious framerates and gained power over DX renderer.

It is sad, that Vista is a minimum system (for BF4), tough. But it is probably true, that any older OS cannot run the 64 bit HW well, so...

sf101 October 1, 2013 12:55 AM

nvidia also must know that the amount of time it takes for them to code in this way would need to be benefited by being able to cross platform from console to pc..

why the hell would they use nvidia's method of coding unless its a pc only title.

and in that case not mainstream at all.

i put my $ on console ports being the leverage needed to implement this type of thing amd is trying to do.

looks like they might just pull off a amazing switcheroo here.

Dzzope October 1, 2013 03:31 AM


Originally Posted by sf101 (Post 732604)
why the hell would they use nvidia's method of coding unless its a pc only title.

Cos it's standard Direct X and will run on either the PS4, Xbox one or ANY PC? As well as increased development costs for mantle.

It's not as cut and dry as you seem to think, there are big problems to get around and as with everything there are cons for the developers too.
Think how much market you may alienate from your game if you adopt this and you game runs brilliantly on GCN hardware but like a dog on nvidia, Intel or even anything older than the 7xxx line?

Not to mention it needs to be well supported and have great benefits to begin with. I will believe it when I see it, for now, I'll hope that they can make improvements but am not worried that my nvidia cards are going to become obsolete overnight.

Vista is the oldest supported by BF4 for probably 3 reasons.
1) no one uses it
2) it doesn't support DX11
3) Microsoft are withdrawing support in 6 months ~ (April 8th)

chrisk October 1, 2013 04:12 AM

While I don't like the fact that nVidia, Intel, and older cards won't work with Mantle (actually, I really don't like it), if a company is to do this, it is when they have the console market all wrapped up.

I have not seen any news on this recently, but how are AMD's financials? Wondering if this is a 'desperate times call for' situation? I would like to think that things look ok with the PS4 and Xbone production ramping up no?

SKYMTL October 1, 2013 04:53 AM

Actually, you could almost see Mantle coming. AMD needed to leverage their presence in the console market and somehow cascade that down to the PC space. That's what Mantle is doing....and then some. Imagine what this could do for APUs.

Dzzope October 1, 2013 05:23 AM

You could say that they needed more leverage on their APU's which is why they went to consoles... piece by piece it could be coming together... I really hope they don't screw it up.
But it's still going to take to my next scheduled re-fresh to really see if this will catch on.

sswilson October 1, 2013 05:26 AM

It's not like Nvidia hasn't been playing this game as well... they've been pushing their proprietary cuda and PhysX for quite some time and getting a lot of flak from the open source community for lack of support on all things non-proprietary.

I'm seeing two different narratives here though.... most references seem to suggest that DirectX would still be a base requirement with Mantle being a selectable option once that was in place, while a few others seem to suggest that it might be able to run either stand alone, or with some form of open source option..... (The Frostbite engine seems to suggest the latter)

Would mantle support a stand-alone option that could conceivably be run with a basic Linux install and/or something like a steam OS?

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