Go Back   Hardware Canucks > HARDWARE > Video Cards

    
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #31 (permalink)  
Old September 21, 2012, 07:01 AM
Top Prospect
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 50
Default

Fair enough, but if anyone at AMD reads this I really think that software will be just as important as hardware going forward. CCC hasn't been updated in some time and the current interface is somewhat dated now, and whether it is deserved or not ATI gets a bad rap for multi GPU issues. I really, really hope AMD releases a killer part with the 8000 series, and I really have to underscore the fact that software is of critical importance! I'm currently using nvidia and have been for a couple of gens - but I would love for AMD to have a big win with their next part. Software will be a huge part of that, I don't think people will settle for waiting months for multi GPU profiles. If it happens to a reviewer, more often than not they will mention it - when a consumer sees no scaling on an ATI part yet good scaling on nvidia....that will obviously have an effect on perception.
Reply With Quote
  #32 (permalink)  
Old September 21, 2012, 07:02 AM
SKYMTL's Avatar
HardwareCanuck Review Editor
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Montreal
Posts: 11,776
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by velias View Post
A lot of people feel nvidia does better in terms of multi GPU profiles, is that a fair assessment?
I'd address that question in two ways. First and foremost, I believe there was a time when AMD's Crossfire profile development was behind NVIDIA's. It was that ~year around the 5000-series where things really weren't all that pretty and it did give AMD's drivers a bad name in certain circles. The HD 6000-series did feature drastically better compatibility of Crossfire within games but there were still some stumbling blocks. The HD 7000 series is another step in the right direction.

This isn't to say that NVIDIA was absolutely perfect because I distinctly remember SLI issues with Starcraft II and a number of other popular games after patches or initial releases.

In the past, we can't forget that NVIDIA poured an obscene amount of money into their TWIMTBP program and it paid dividends. AMD's Gaming Evolved program was around but not nearly as effective as it looks to be this coming year. Developer relations are a huge deal when it comes to optimizations as well and it seemed NVIDIA was significantly ahead in this regard.

Personally, I think many AMD driver issues stem from the fact that their uninstaller needs reworking. It leaves far too many little gremlins from past installs running around the system, potentially screwing the pooch. Fro example, I have to run the driver-based uninstaller (no, the Device Manager shortcut won't cut it with AMD drivers) and then run BOTH Driver Cleaner and Driver Sweeper in Safe Mode after uninstalling an AMD graphics card. If I don't, the system will likely throw a fit when I either A) Install an NVIDIA GPU or B) Install a Crossfire setup. With the newest NVIDIA drivers, I can literally run the Device Manager uninstaller and be confident that SLI, single cards, AMD cards or Crossfire can be installed once the system is rebooted.

At the risk of sounding petty, the mere fact that we need to use secondary software tools to properly uninstall drivers simply boggles the mind. AMD and NVIDIA know exactly what's installed; why can't their uninstallers get ALL of it out of our systems? If that can happen, I can almost promise you that the vast majority of problems (other than missing / broken profiles) will be effectively fixed.

So are NVIDIA's multi drivers "better" than AMD's? These days, I'd say they're pretty even. What people seem to forget is that great strides have been made with the APP Profiles. What AMD needs to work on is getting the word out whenever a new CAP file is released.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #33 (permalink)  
Old September 21, 2012, 07:07 AM
Top Prospect
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 50
Default

Very true. I've heard this issue from a few friends as well, AMD should put something like a "clean install" option that wipes everything including registry entries from the old install. There were also a few driver releases that broke HDMI audio.

A lot of people use driver sweeper as a regular practice for AMD drivers, and they shouldn't have to. You're spot on, they should really improve this - a clean install option like nvidia has would be great.
Reply With Quote
  #34 (permalink)  
Old September 21, 2012, 07:11 AM
great_big_abyss's Avatar
Hall Of Fame
F@H
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Winnipeg
Posts: 2,210

My System Specs

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SKYMTL View Post
So are NVIDIA's multi drivers "better" than AMD's? These days, I'd say they're pretty even. What people seem to forget is that great strides have been made with the APP Profiles. What AMD needs to work on is getting the word out whenever a new CAP file is released.
Can we use this when people start recommending Nvidia cards based solely on 'AMD's drivers are Sh!t"???

(I'm not seriously asking if can use that, but ya know, people heap on AMD a lot for their drivers)
__________________



HTPC: Z77A-G45; 3770K; Coolermaster GeminII; 2x4GB Kingston HyperX 1600Mhz; MSI R7-260X; 2x 128GB Crucial M4 SSD; 1TB WD Green, 2x 2TB WD Green; PC P&C 750W PS; Fractal Design Node 605;
Son's Rig: M5A97; 1055T; CNPS20LQ; 2x4GB Corsair Vengeance 1600Mhz; ASUS GTX650Ti Boost; 80GB Intel 520 SSD; 320GB WD Black HDD; SPI 700W; Bitfenix Shinobi;
Reply With Quote
  #35 (permalink)  
Old September 21, 2012, 10:17 AM
AMD Rep
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 16
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by velias View Post
CCC hasn't been updated in some time...
IIRC the current overall "theme" of CCC is newer than NVIDIA's control panel. Sub pages have been revamped periodically as well (eg the video and overdrive panels have had significant overhauls not that long ago). Look for some changes to the 3D / Application settings page in the future as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SKYMTL View Post
Personally, I think many AMD driver issues stem from the fact that their uninstaller needs reworking.
A "complete uninstall" feature is in the software development pipeline.
Reply With Quote
  #36 (permalink)  
Old September 21, 2012, 11:41 AM
SKYMTL's Avatar
HardwareCanuck Review Editor
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Montreal
Posts: 11,776
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Baumann View Post
I
A "complete uninstall" feature is in the software development pipeline.
Oh good god....YES!
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #37 (permalink)  
Old September 21, 2012, 11:53 AM
Soultribunal's Avatar
Moderator
F@H
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Mississauga
Posts: 8,067

My System Specs

Default

I was thinking the same thing SKY, it has been a long time since I've had a clean un-install of CCC etc..
Would be nice.

One question for you Dave, you have many other reports of issues with CF and WoW, WoT or EVE?

Those 3 games of mine never worked properly with my 6950's. To the point where I purchased something else and got rid of the cards.

-ST
__________________




"We know not why he calls for us, only that when he does we must answer" - DMP 2009

"Dear Iceberg, I am sorry to hear about global warming. Karma is a bitch. Signed - Titanic"

I would rather believe and find god doesn't exist than to not believe and find that he does.

www.realhardwarereviews.com
Reply With Quote
  #38 (permalink)  
Old September 21, 2012, 12:46 PM
EmptyMellon's Avatar
MVP
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 434

My System Specs

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by great_big_abyss View Post
Can we use this when people start recommending Nvidia cards based solely on 'AMD's drivers are Sh!t"???
...
The problem is not that AMD drivers are poopoo or kaka, it is a matter of consistency, and AMD/ATi's drivers are weee bit more inconsistent (historically) than nVidia's; now seeing FAIL in performance-bench graph(s) [especially when it's know to performe well in specific benches and then it fails] does not bode well for any card (high-end or low), as it reflects on the whole product line. Same can be said about the workstation side of the video card market - though AMD has made great strides in the last year or so, it remains to be seen where they stand as nVidia has not yet come out with their workstation Kepler cards.
Reply With Quote
  #39 (permalink)  
Old September 22, 2012, 12:53 AM
Dzzope's Avatar
Hall Of Fame
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Irishman in Kiev, wOOoo, I'm an alien...
Posts: 2,858

My System Specs

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by EmptyMellon View Post
The problem is not that AMD drivers are poopoo or kaka, it is a matter of consistency, and AMD/ATi's drivers are weee bit more inconsistent (historically) than nVidia's; now seeing FAIL in performance-bench graph(s) [especially when it's know to performe well in specific benches and then it fails] does not bode well for any card (high-end or low), as it reflects on the whole product line. Same can be said about the workstation side of the video card market - though AMD has made great strides in the last year or so, it remains to be seen where they stand as nVidia has not yet come out with their workstation Kepler cards.
This.. This is my issue with AMD drivers.. Have things gotten better, I hope to god they have BUT there was a point where out of every 2 or 3 driver releases I had to roll-back..

The slowness on the release of profiles and fixing of profiles for CF is the main reason that I will currently always recommend Nvidia over AMD for multi card set-ups.
Do Nvidia have their issues too, god yes.. BUT they tend to deal with them MUCH better and quicker than AMD.

You had a fail in a test here SKY and if I remember in the 690 review you had some serious issues with CF too, how can you say that CF is as good as SLI when in your own benches, in not particularly new games CF is still having issues.(not saying it's driver, just CF issues)
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
PowerColor HD 7950 3GB Boost State Review Comment Thread SKYMTL Video Cards 78 October 31, 2012 02:31 PM
Hardware Canucks’ Sources Vindicated, PowerColor Releases Dual-GPU 7990 Sam_Reynolds Press Releases & Tech News 9 August 25, 2012 06:53 PM
HD 7990 Coming Very Soon as PowerColor Devil 13 SKYMTL Video Cards 25 August 23, 2012 02:47 PM
PowerColor HD 6850 1GB SCS3 Passive Review Comment Thread SKYMTL Video Cards 13 July 10, 2011 06:41 AM