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  #41 (permalink)  
Old August 14, 2012, 06:06 PM
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Originally Posted by nvidiots View Post
Wow, I cant believe the fuss you guys are making, never saw this here with the 680 paper launch, plus this BIOS update is just that, an update, just like drivers...

This update is FOR REFERENCE CARDS ONLY and is available to ALL ref card users (Updating BIOS does not void warranty) which is why you have dual switch in the first place.

The 7970 GE are availabe on USA newegg and most of the EU/UK etc. people that had purchased them before the BIOS can also update, so whats all the fuss about?

Everything you have said about bios, 7970 gigahertz edition and 7950 BIOS, warranty etc etc is not true
If that's the case, then where is the link to the bios update from the official AMD website? If it's available to all reference card users it should be available both from AMD and from their board partners.

In all honesty, this isn't about the bios update. If it becomes available from official channels I say more power to them it's great to see folks get more value for their purchases. It's about AMD asking reviewers to "fudge" benchmark numbers in a review for a competetors product by using a questionable bios update they don't feel comfortable enough to release officially. If they want to have the new version of the 7950 reviewed, they're more than welcome to send out review units for comparison.
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  #42 (permalink)  
Old August 14, 2012, 06:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidiots View Post
AMD Rolls Out New HD 7950 BIOS, Expects Existing Customers to Look the Other Way



That title is not accurate bcoz existing reference card holders are expected or have an choice to upgrade, which makes the title moot.


Am expecting 90% of reviews of the 660 to have an fully updated BIOS 7950 card (Some after market cards will get it, some wont - but this is about standard 7950 cards), so don`t think it will matter much as most people look at a couple of reviews when deciding.


I just don`t think its worth doing what you are, i would rather stay neutral to both camps and install updates as requested from either camp, in the end, its you're choice
Sky said he was updating his card and testing it he just felt the need to have a small article about AMD's honesty in the matter. It isn't biased to not use AMD's update, people look at reviews to see the comparitive performance of hardware. If you are using a bios which can't be used by the average consumer clearly you aren't representing that product very well.

As a matter of fact I would say that if you insist on using this update in your review and not show the non-updated bios numbers along side it you are biased towards AMD because you are misrepresenting their product making it look better than it will be for you.

Existing reference card owners are expected to have the choice to upgrade yet at the launch of the 660 that upgrade will not be available to you without voiding your warranty.

Also Sky uses AMD cards in his home system, he writes great reviews for AMD and gives them credit where credit is due however this is a dishonest marketing ploy by AMD and he is informing us about it before we read his review and go WTF why is the 7950 so much better than mine.
  #43 (permalink)  
Old August 14, 2012, 07:31 PM
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Let's set a few things straight here since I believe you bring up valid points.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nvidiots View Post
Wow, I cant believe the fuss you guys are making, never saw this here with the 680 paper launch, plus this BIOS update is just that, an update, just like drivers...
Paper launch = cards not being available at launch. The HD 7970 was a paper launch. As was the GTX 280 way back in the day.

Plenty of people here and on other forums got their cards on launch day.


Quote:
This update is FOR REFERENCE CARDS ONLY and is available to ALL ref card users (Updating BIOS does not void warranty) which is why you have dual switch in the first place.
I think you are missing the point. AMD has stated that the card should be switched into Position #1 for the update. That's the main BIOS. Had AMD said that you could flash this into the #2 slot, a good quarter of my concerns would have been eliminated.

Quote:
The 7970 GE are availabe on USA newegg and most of the EU/UK etc. people that had purchased them before the BIOS can also update, so whats all the fuss about?
The GHz Edition was launched......and then nothing. The first so-called GHz Editions were only made available 2 weeks ago. *Ahem* paper launch.

Quote:
Everything you have said about bios, 7970 gigahertz edition and 7950 BIOS, warranty etc etc is not true
Prove it. Show me an AIB partner who will warrant an AMD card that has had its primary BIOS reflashed. Please, by all means.

Actually, to prove my point, I'll give it over to Ryan at Anandtech:

Quote:
Furthermore they’re also allowing us to post the 7950B BIOS, so that anyone else with a reference 7950 who wants to convert their card can go ahead and do so. It goes without saying that doing this will almost certainly void your warranty
Quote:
With that said however, because of AMD’s past product launches we’re left in an unfortunate position where we have to seriously question AMD’s credibility when it comes to product availability. To be blunt, in the last couple of months AMD has had major execution problems.
Quote:
Meanwhile the 7970GE was supposed to be available in late June only to miss that by over a month, with cards only becoming available in the last two weeks.

So let me guess, one of the most respected websites on the planet is also lying just because the statements don't live up to your expectations of an untarnished AMD image? Ryan's a straight shooter if there ever was one.

Quote:
That title is not accurate bcoz existing reference card holders are expected or have an choice to upgrade, which makes the title moot.
I see no choice since the BIOS is being flashed into the #1 slot. That overrides the default settings no matter what.

Quote:
Am expecting 90% of reviews of the 660 to have an fully updated BIOS 7950 card (Some after market cards will get it, some wont - but this is about standard 7950 cards), so don`t think it will matter much as most people look at a couple of reviews when deciding.
In that case, I'd call that a lapse in judgement in order to make one company happy. They're testing a card that isn't available in any way, shape or form. Nor can they bring forward a conclusion since pricing hasn't been determined.

Yeah, we'll test the HD 7950 V2....once it is available so we can accurately judge its position within the market. On the other hand, the possibility of it being available at some time will certainly be mentioned in any NVIDIA review. But will it actually be included? Of course not....for the same reason we never tested overclocked GTX 460 cards in the HD 6800-series articles (against the suggestion of NVIDIA I might add).

Basically, the issue here is twofold: #1: AMD released this BIOS knowing that we reviewers were in the middle of testing the new NVIDIA cards. This means we spend less time with that and a bit more time on AMD. #2: It was sent last night. Two days before launch. To me, that is not enough time to properly evaluate and test a card. So no, unless a miracle happens, it numbers can't be included in any review this week simply due to the fact that I cannot and will not rush through testing because someone decided to pull a rabbit out of their hats 60 hours before a launch.

All in all, it is a brilliant marketing stunt by AMD since it essentially takes the press's focus off of NVIDIA while also slotting in a (so far) mythical card that has better performance and who-knows-which price.


And no one is going to block you. You have your right to speak up.
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Last edited by SKYMTL; August 14, 2012 at 09:25 PM.
  #44 (permalink)  
Old August 14, 2012, 08:11 PM
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Quote:
And no one is going to block you. You have your right to speak up.
Correct, Your First post was blocked as a Spam Deterrent (its automated from VB, not from the Moderation team). And then your subsequent posts were merged into one because its a forum rule to prevent spamming of Topics and allow proper responses. Everyone is well within there right to speak there minds here so long as it falls within forum practice guidelines.

Enjoy your stay here,

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  #45 (permalink)  
Old August 14, 2012, 09:21 PM
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Hooray for AnandTech invasion! The battle of America vs Canada!

Ok anyways.... Cliff notes?
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  #46 (permalink)  
Old August 15, 2012, 05:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geokilla View Post
Hooray for AnandTech invasion! The battle of America vs Canada!

Ok anyways.... Cliff notes?
Cliffnotes:
Fanbois are gonna fan (not you geo but the AMD 'fans').

Mfg'ers are gonna try and make their products look better...even if it means resorting to dirty tricks. And a non-std BIOS not meant for the gen pop...is simply not cricket. :(
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  #47 (permalink)  
Old August 15, 2012, 09:36 AM
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Just wanted to give a quick update, having flashed all 3 of my cards (all ref cards) I have had 0 issues thus far.

1 thing to note, that because they increased the stock 3D voltage I am now able to clock the card higher then I could before by just using CCC, which is nice as you won't have to worry about installing an extra program just to OC the card.
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  #48 (permalink)  
Old August 15, 2012, 02:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drkCrix View Post
Just wanted to give a quick update, having flashed all 3 of my cards (all ref cards) I have had 0 issues thus far.

1 thing to note, that because they increased the stock 3D voltage I am now able to clock the card higher then I could before by just using CCC, which is nice as you won't have to worry about installing an extra program just to OC the card.
How are the cards for noise, at idle and load, compared to pre BIOS flash?
  #49 (permalink)  
Old August 15, 2012, 03:10 PM
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@skymtl: Ryan is definitely a straight shooter, though I remember that I was pretty pissed off when he caved in to NV and used the 460 ftw in the 6870/50 review. Your comments are spot on about both camps attempts to rain on the competitor's parade, it's extremely annoying to knowledgeable users and confusing to n00bs. However, I am at least a bit impressed that AMD has finally started to fight back a bit. Maybe firing 2/3 of their marketing department wasn't such a bad idea, after all...
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Old August 15, 2012, 03:24 PM
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i agree with skys thoughts and perception on this trickery amd is pulling, trying to steal any potential thunder for nVidia. It isa by no "conincidence" that this bios is "ready" for reviews so short to the launch of 660, and the fact that it is not highlighted for the previous owners is abasmal. AMD needs to find where they were a year or so ago, and go back there. because frankly where they are and where they are headed has made me personally switch to the green camp. and I havent touched anything green since my 9600 years ago.

edit...

and not trying to offend anyone,

but the "new" users that have been visiting this site lately that call out any reviews being biased to one camp or another, clearly need to spend some more time here, or go back through previous reviews, and see that there is no preferences. Sky, presents the info like he gets it and gives an opinion on it via performance/cost ratio, and its place in the market at that time. I have seen great reviews on both sides, and horrible for both. I am pretty sure this site is the reason I bought my 6950 and I also recently bought a 670. Point: Keep up the great work HWC reviewers!

Last edited by maverick_brent; August 15, 2012 at 03:43 PM.
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