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Old March 4, 2011, 09:39 PM
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Yes. Both motherboards, actually, are asus-based as well.
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Old March 4, 2011, 09:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AkG View Post
it will only show (IIRC for the "120GB" model)
I'm curious about this...

My Vertex 2 only shows up as 111GB in Windows. It's definitely 34nm. Is it the typical GB to byte conversion loss? Or was it supposed to be a full 120GB?

My original Vertex shows as a solid 60GB though.

(Sorry for the minor thread jack)
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Old March 5, 2011, 01:36 AM
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Trouble is the E isn't really a useful guarantee of whether or not you've received an SSD based on 34 or 25 nm NAND. Reviews have been done with two models, both with E in the model number, which turned out to have different NAND configurations.
OCZ Vertex 2 25nm Review (OCZSSD2-2VTXE60G) | StorageReview.com
For that matter, I own an E-marked 60GB drive with 55.8GiB usable space (60 billion bytes) and it is far too old to be a 25nm product.

It also doesn't tell you if the NAND is arranged to populate all the channels (which gives more speed) or not. Firmware on the 25nm is also set to slow compressed data writes to preserve life time and warranty. This is supposedly justified by charging less per GiB. Though I understood that they were supposed to be cheaper because 25 nm is cheaper to produce...and I've not noticed any particular differences in prices.

OCZ did release a software tool to tell you if the SSD you received uses the lower-density arrangement of 32 Gbit NAND (more channels populated) or the 64Gbit NAND, which they've evidently stopped producing. Any replacements OCZ offers will still be 25 nm, just in using 32Gbit rather than 64Gbit NAND.
Guide New update on the 64Gb IC OCZ SSD drives

Tool: http://www.ocztechnologyforum.com/st...olbox_v233.zip

Big thread on the OCZ forums, which covers a lot of this: Guide New update on the 64Gb IC OCZ SSD drives
"Remember the 60 and 120GB drives are all built with 64GB and 128GB of Nand, the issue is RAISE takes roughly 8GB of space on a 64Gbit IC drive where it takes 4GB on a 32GB IC drive."
I did notice in this thread in the last few days even the moderators have started to goof and identify the difference between the low-density and high-density NAND in GB instead of Gbit.

Not that familiar with Win 7 and Intel chipsets, but doesn't using the Intel RST 10.x drivers with AHCI controller leave the OCZ Toolbox unable to see the drive?

Last edited by Galcobar; March 5, 2011 at 05:22 AM.
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Old March 5, 2011, 09:39 AM
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I have to wait until tuesday (when they get another shipment in) to replace my damn drive, too. Damnit, I was hoping to use the weekend to get windows all reinstalled and have my superfast computer ready to go for monday.

Anyways, I'd like to thank you all for helping me out; not just as a knowledge base, but fellow computer buddies :D
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HDD : Main: 120GB SSD SATA2 (OCZ) Storage: 3TB SATA2 (WD Green) Backup: 500GB External USB (Hitatchi)
GFX : HD4850 (512MB)
PSU : 610W PC Power Silencer
MoBo: Asus P5Q SE
View : Acer H213H 21.5" @ 1920 x 1080

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Old March 5, 2011, 10:53 AM
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When I say GB I am talking GB in the SI sense as that is the std all the storage mfg'ers use (1 billion bytes).

So the new 25nm's would be 118GiB and not 120GiB. In the std nomenclature as seen by the OS that would be 109.89'ish GB vs 111.75'ish

The lowered performance is actually less worrisome than the lower life span. Sure the firmware has been "tweaked" to use less writes....but when dealing with SF drives that is extremely variable. The write amplification is certainly low under perfect conditions BUT when dealing with data that is already compressed...it cant really do much more compression on it (say rar files or other data that is compressed by default). This controller and all but the latest firmware was based on certain engineering assumptions, I have yet to see ANY controller mfg'er get the firmware "perfect" on one (or even 5) tries...which is exactly what we are talking about when it comes to the latest NAND and firmware. I personally am buying either OLDER 34nm drives (GUARANTEED to be 34nm by the mfg'er...take that for what you will) or waiting for the second gen SF controller (and others) which should have any "kinks" worked out with regards to 2xNM nand.

At the end of the day 3K should be enough for most users needs, and the added OverProvesioning should deal with it better. BUT I personally am not willing to take a chance on it. These extended SF drives already have significantly lowered OP than originally was called for by the mfg'er (and thus are the "extended" drives) and that OP was based on cells lasting 5K under harsh conditions. By using an "additional" 2GB the Es are still MUCH less OP'ed than the original versions (eg 100 vs 118). As TONY over on OCZ once said when asked on extended vs original versions (and Im paraphrasing as Im too lazy to dig it up again) "when I want more space I stick another SSD in there". My opinion is very similar.

If I am buying for a customer I NEED the drive to last 5 years, not 2, not 3, not 4, BUT FIVE at the minimum. Anything less is simply not trustworthy in a rig that has MY reputation behind it (even if the rig is only going to be used for 2-3 yrs before being upgraded). Its easier to do that and TRUST it do that with a drive that has a good low write amplification on 5K nand than it is on one with 3K nand. Will I trust the next gen? Yes as I said they will have worked out the "hows" and the "whys" to do so with the newer controllers. This kind of change over takes TIME and RnD. I am by nature ultra conservative when it comes to changes in mid stream and will take a KNOWN quantity over an unknown..and the 3ks fall into the "unknown" right now.

This is only my personal opinion. I am may be wrong and I may be missing out on some good deals, but I rather be wrong on this issue than deal with the consequences of having a customer unhappy with me in 18mths time. YMMV and I think everyone needs to look at this issue carefully and then make their own decision based on their own needs and comfort levels...after all we ARE seeing some pretty good deals pop up with the 25nm SSDS!


Quote:
Originally Posted by JD View Post
I'm curious about this...

My Vertex 2 only shows up as 111GB in Windows. It's definitely 34nm. Is it the typical GB to byte conversion loss? Or was it supposed to be a full 120GB?

My original Vertex shows as a solid 60GB though.

(Sorry for the minor thread jack)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Galcobar View Post
Trouble is the E isn't really a useful guarantee of whether or not you've received an SSD based on 34 or 25 nm NAND. Reviews have been done with two models, both with E in the model number, which turned out to have different NAND configurations.
OCZ Vertex 2 25nm Review (OCZSSD2-2VTXE60G) | StorageReview.com
For that matter, I own an E-marked 60GB drive with 55.8GiB usable space (60 billion bytes) and it is far too old to be a 25nm product.

It also doesn't tell you if the NAND is arranged to populate all the channels (which gives more speed) or not. Firmware on the 25nm is also set to slow compressed data writes to preserve life time and warranty. This is supposedly justified by charging less per GiB. Though I understood that they were supposed to be cheaper because 25 nm is cheaper to produce...and I've not noticed any particular differences in prices.

OCZ did release a software tool to tell you if the SSD you received uses the lower-density arrangement of 32 Gbit NAND (more channels populated) or the 64Gbit NAND, which they've evidently stopped producing. Any replacements OCZ offers will still be 25 nm, just in using 32Gbit rather than 64Gbit NAND.
Guide New update on the 64Gb IC OCZ SSD drives

Tool: http://www.ocztechnologyforum.com/st...olbox_v233.zip

Big thread on the OCZ forums, which covers a lot of this: Guide New update on the 64Gb IC OCZ SSD drives
"Remember the 60 and 120GB drives are all built with 64GB and 128GB of Nand, the issue is RAISE takes roughly 8GB of space on a 64Gbit IC drive where it takes 4GB on a 32GB IC drive."
I did notice in this thread in the last few days even the moderators have started to goof and identify the difference between the low-density and high-density NAND in GB instead of Gbit.

Not that familiar with Win 7 and Intel chipsets, but doesn't using the Intel RST 10.x drivers with AHCI controller leave the OCZ Toolbox unable to see the drive?
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Last edited by AkG; March 5, 2011 at 11:17 AM. Reason: spelling
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