Go Back   Hardware Canucks > HARDWARE > Storage

    
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old January 15, 2010, 11:03 AM
Top Prospect
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 84

My System Specs

Default Raid information

I'm just trying to figure out this whole raid thing...I don't know very much about it at all.
I've been using the raid on my mobo for about 2 months now and I'm not having any problems or anything...but its raised some questions that I'm having difficulty finding proper answers on my own.
I'm not only considering this for the speed difference, but because I have no internal sata connectors left and was considering getting an addon card for more, but then got looking at raid cards instead :P

1. I was of the understanding that the raid on my mobo was just "software" based. I decided to consider looking at hardware based and was reading different things. I found a guide to raid and i guess it wasn't terrific because I'm here looking for clarification. So first off, am I right to say that my mobo has software raid? I just saw this question answered in another section...Thanks

2. Whether I am correct in the above or not, would I see a tremendous difference buying a separate raid controller, or would it be nominal, or no difference?

3. After looking at Raid cards and looking at different guides and such, I started questioning what exactly is hardware raid and how can i tell for sure that a card is HARDWARE and not software based? The varying prices threw me and I wasn't really sure what I was looking at.

4. Would I be correct to assume that if I bought a hardware raid controller, my other drives hoooked through my motherboard would no longer be "extra drives" in the raid as they are now? (I hope I didn't lose anyone here lol)

5. I've also began to wonder about compatibility, are raid controllers finicky about being compatible? Are they compatible with SSD's, or does this change my options?

Thanks in advance.

I'm currently using 2 SSD's in Raid 0, but who knows what the future will bring. I'm already considering adding a mirror, but that brings a whole bunch more questions :P
Like, as it stands I have 2 60gb drives in raid 0, so could I use 1 120gb drive as the mirror?
Just curious

Last edited by Canzara; January 15, 2010 at 11:14 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old January 15, 2010, 11:17 AM
MarkOne's Avatar
Banned
F@H
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Chertsey 60 KM north of Montreal
Posts: 4,015
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Canzara View Post
3. After looking at Raid cards and looking at different guides and such, I started questioning what exactly is hardware raid and how can i tell for sure that a card is HARDWARE and not software based? The varying prices threw me and I wasn't really sure what I was looking at.

very simple real hardware raid card have on board processors and memory, you have card with better processor than other. ( price go with it ) all those on board processor raid solution cost $ 400 and up ( I'm not to much update on the price ) but the one under $ 200 , don't have processor, and are not better than your on board raid, with only 2 ssd you don't need anything else than your on board raid . a
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old January 15, 2010, 11:29 AM
Perineum's Avatar
Hall Of Fame
F@H
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Surrey, B.C.
Posts: 4,037

My System Specs

Default

Hardware RAID cards have a processor on board to do XOR calculations for parity. This happens with with RAID 5. If you are running RAID 0 or 1 then it's not going to matter so much.

However, there are quite knowledgable RAID guys on here....

I wouldn't mind hearing Lowfat's opinion....
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old January 15, 2010, 11:34 AM
Top Prospect
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 84

My System Specs

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Perineum View Post
Hardware RAID cards have a processor on board to do XOR calculations for parity. This happens with with RAID 5. If you are running RAID 0 or 1 then it's not going to matter so much.

However, there are quite knowledgable RAID guys on here....

I wouldn't mind hearing Lowfat's opinion....
Ya, I'm really interested in learning, either way.
It may not be that beneficial for my personal use, but its always benificial to learn and I've been known to buy many things simply because i wanted to learn how it worked :P

Cards that have they're own processor, I'm guessing a description should specifically state this plainly?
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old January 15, 2010, 11:40 AM
MarkOne's Avatar
Banned
F@H
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Chertsey 60 KM north of Montreal
Posts: 4,015
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Perineum View Post
Hardware RAID cards have a processor on board to do XOR calculations for parity. This happens with with RAID 5. If you are running RAID 0 or 1 then it's not going to matter so much.

However, there are quite knowledgable RAID guys on here....

I wouldn't mind hearing Lowfat's opinion....

exactly, they are generally use for raid 5. if I'm not mistake, he will loose speed if he use them with raid 0 instead of use the Intel one.
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old January 15, 2010, 01:14 PM
lcdguy's Avatar
Hall Of Fame
F@H
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: An undisclosed location
Posts: 2,048
Default

The other advantage with a hardware raid controller is that hdd's a configured with a specific controller. so say you decide you want to change the motherboard or such. This would result in a reconfiguration of your raid setup possibly involving length restore from backup (yes you should be backing your data off of your HDD despite the raid level). With a hardware raid all you would need to do in an upgrade would be to make sure the card is compatible with the new computer and reinstall any applications if needed but the data should be fine. Also if your card dies just get another card with the exact same model and firmware and you should be able to import your raid disks in. Finally i would strongly recommend a SAS raid card. The reason for this is it's a bit of future proofing and just about every manufacturer out there has break out cables so you can just hook up regular SATA drives without the need or expense of a SAS expander. But if you decide you want to go SAS since the device per channel is ridiculous then you still have that option. I would recommend either the 3ware (around $400-$700 depending on the number of SAS channels) or a used perc 5i/6i. The dells are usually a lot cheaper but as a result require some finesse and modding. (you will need mounting brackets, break out cables and a fan to cool the unit. also if you have an Intel board you will need to cover or cut the pcie traces for b5 and b6. Amd boards work fine). I am sure low fat will post here as well.
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old January 15, 2010, 04:38 PM
Perineum's Avatar
Hall Of Fame
F@H
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Surrey, B.C.
Posts: 4,037

My System Specs

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Canzara View Post
Ya, I'm really interested in learning, either way.
It may not be that beneficial for my personal use, but its always benificial to learn and I've been known to buy many things simply because i wanted to learn how it worked :P

Cards that have they're own processor, I'm guessing a description should specifically state this plainly?
I think they'll say that they are "XOR accelerated" or something along those lines. They'll let you know and the price tag is usually a good hint too....

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkOne View Post
exactly, they are generally use for raid 5. if I'm not mistake, he will loose speed if he use them with raid 0 instead of use the Intel one.
For some reason that doesn't seem right to me. I would suggest that a dedicated RAID card, with the onboard cache and batter backup should have greater thruput even in RAID 0 and 1. Also, I've heard that a RAID card will have greater read speed in RAID 1 as it would read from both drives at once. Not sure if generic RAID controllers allow that in RAID 1

Really though, the onboard Intel ICH10R doesn't seem that bad, it's got RAID Migration (allows you to change your RAID from say, R1 to R5 without losing data) and it's also got online RAID expansion (allowing you to add more drives to your array to increase space all while the RAID is still up and running)

Last edited by Perineum; January 15, 2010 at 04:43 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old January 15, 2010, 05:11 PM
Top Prospect
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 84

My System Specs

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Perineum View Post
Really though, the onboard Intel ICH10R doesn't seem that bad, it's got RAID Migration (allows you to change your RAID from say, R1 to R5 without losing data) and it's also got online RAID expansion (allowing you to add more drives to your array to increase space all while the RAID is still up and running)
I'm using an AMD board that allows all this once you install the Raid software from AMD's website, its called Raid expert and is a web based config. After using overdrive and fusion though, I'm not sure I want to count on it.
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old January 15, 2010, 05:37 PM
Perineum's Avatar
Hall Of Fame
F@H
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Surrey, B.C.
Posts: 4,037

My System Specs

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Canzara View Post
After using overdrive and fusion though, I'm not sure I want to count on it.
Hell, I just about spit up my dinner all over my monitor from that comment
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old January 15, 2010, 06:00 PM
MarkOne's Avatar
Banned
F@H
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Chertsey 60 KM north of Montreal
Posts: 4,015
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Perineum View Post
For some reason that doesn't seem right to me. I would suggest that a dedicated RAID card, with the onboard cache and batter backup should have greater thruput even in RAID 0 and 1. Also, I've heard that a RAID card will have greater read speed in RAID 1 as it would read from both drives at once. Not sure if generic RAID controllers allow that in RAID 1
yes the raid card read faster. but it's the transfer between the card and the cpu , that I thing it's slower than true the south bridge .

but honestly I have not make research on it as it will not worth to put a card of $ 500 for raid 0 or raid 1. I also see no use to raid 5 in a PC. better build a server no
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
5750 Information Iphikratous Rumor Mill 2 October 8, 2009 02:46 PM
Some general information m0pelley99 Water Cooling 9 July 8, 2009 08:00 PM
General Information for my Edukation! RainMaker Display Units 0 January 19, 2009 10:09 AM
[WTB] Need a little information Wurmer Buy/Sell & Trade 3 November 29, 2008 08:06 AM
Beginning Overclocking - Looking for Information S|nApSE Overclocking, Tweaking and Benchmarking 19 May 6, 2007 09:37 PM