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Old January 14, 2014, 02:00 PM
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Because having to know the core of an OS to run it through command lines shows that it's a great update to the UI over what windows 7 provided. Logic!

Also my point was that Windows Phone 8 which is just windows 8 for phones... uses Metro Crap UI just like they decided windows couldn't exist without. Is it a touch screen device OS or is it a PC OS it can't be both well.
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Old January 14, 2014, 02:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Fudd Rucker View Post
You know how I made due without a start button until I figured out 8? The run command and typed my commands for things I needed. If your a "tech" or "enthusiast" you should know the god damn core of the operating syte, . The core commands haven't changed really in ages.

If you can't navigate and use an OS because you don't know how to use it without a pretty interface or icon serving it to you on a platter - then the OS isn't the issue. Its the user.

FYI - Alt + F4 still works just fine to shut down a PC. Has worked since 3.1 days. Just an example of why this is utter nonsense. If you want to remain obtuse and refuse to even attempt to learn something new , then don't shit talk something because of that. Its not like you have to relearn your OS with every iteration. Up until metro , there hasn't been any real change since 95 in the realm of the windows GUI.

As my previous post - im not praising M$ , im griping about how utter nonsense and ignorance seems to be dictating the direction of things.
Heh... see this is the part of the win8 discussion I don't understand.... in pretty much every discussion we've had on the subject it ultimately comes down to folks expecting me to work at learning a new interface that offers me nothing in return.

Why should I have to drop down to the command line? Hell DOS 6.22 was what.... 2 decades ago? Why should I have to learn a new interface for windows? Was there something wrong with the old one on the desktop? Does this new interface offer me something beneficial that the previous one didn't?

Every one of the discussions we've had on the subject seems to end up with the folks who can't understand why I don't want to learn a new interface that offers me no benefits sounding like they're personally affronted by that fact... If you like it, great, fill your boots. I don't, and suspect that the number of returned win8 PCs along with the number of third party start button add-ons that have been sold speaks pretty loudly as to how the market has reacted to the removal of the start button.

8.0 desktop use at release was a complete mess. It was completely unintuitive, and quite frankly damn near unusable without access to a second internet connections for googling (pretty sad when a person has to use an android device to get info on how to operate the latest version of an OS that they've been using for 20 years..... ) help.

8.1 has resolved a great portion of those initial issues, but again... what does it offer me that win7 doesn't?
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Old January 14, 2014, 02:22 PM
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*snip*

8.1 has resolved a great portion of those initial issues, but again... what does it offer me that win7 doesn't?
I would say 8.1 solves all of the issues listed actually.

What does it add? Minor improvements in a variety of areas that may or may not be beneficial to you (or me) directly.

*shrug* User preference. All us "Windows 8 fanbois" are saying is that the hate towards 8.1 is unfounded, and only left over from the (rightful) bad rap that Windows 8 was released with.
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Old January 14, 2014, 02:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sswilson View Post
Heh... see this is the part of the win8 discussion I don't understand.... in pretty much every discussion we've had on the subject it ultimately comes down to folks expecting me to work at learning a new interface that offers me nothing in return.

Why should I have to drop down to the command line? Hell DOS 6.22 was what.... 2 decades ago? Why should I have to learn a new interface for windows? Was there something wrong with the old one on the desktop? Does this new interface offer me something beneficial that the previous one didn't?

Every one of the discussions we've had on the subject seems to end up with the folks who can't understand why I don't want to learn a new interface that offers me no benefits sounding like they're personally affronted by that fact... If you like it, great, fill your boots. I don't, and suspect that the number of returned win8 PCs along with the number of third party start button add-ons that have been sold speaks pretty loudly as to how the market has reacted to the removal of the start button.

8.0 desktop use at release was a complete mess. It was completely unintuitive, and quite frankly damn near unusable without access to a second internet connections for googling (pretty sad when a person has to use an android device to get info on how to operate the latest version of an OS that they've been using for 20 years..... ) help.

8.1 has resolved a great portion of those initial issues, but again... what does it offer me that win7 doesn't?
Heaven forbid you would have to learn and update your skills or change things in a very fast paced constantly evolving sector. What has this world come to? So the skinny of it is - stagnation is where its at.

I cant imagine what you guys would have done in the dos days . Or if your mouse goes on you lol.

Even with 7 I still revert to my command line for a lot of things. It just works better that way, because googling for 40 min with another device is SOOOOOO much more efficient than using windows key + r and the command in question until you figure it out.
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Last edited by Fudd Rucker; January 14, 2014 at 02:42 PM.
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Old January 14, 2014, 02:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sagath View Post
I would say 8.1 solves all of the issues listed actually.

What does it add? Minor improvements in a variety of areas that may or may not be beneficial to you (or me) directly.

*shrug* User preference. All us "Windows 8 fanbois" are saying is that the hate towards 8.1 is unfounded, and only left over from the (rightful) bad rap that Windows 8 was released with.
I can mostly get behind that. While I'm still not a fan of the full page start menu, it wouldn't be a deal breaker for me if I were to get a PC with win 8.1 installed.
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Old January 14, 2014, 05:03 PM
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And there it is "people are just too stupid to understand it" obviously having the accelerator in the handbreak's position is superior to the old way!! Oh wait the market has spoken and no its just stupid. With that attitude you sound more like a Linux apologist than anything out of Redmond.

So just so Im understanding your argument....new is good and old is bad. Anyone who wants the OS to just be an OS and be all but invisible - so they can get work done - are ignorant....yet you have failed to show any examples of how it is superior for most people. Hell you havent even be able to justify the retraining requirements for this change. Why is moving the 'gas pedal' a good idea? Why is telling people RTFM a good idea? As that is exactly what you are saying.

Just so you understand. I think people who call others ignorant when they have legit beefs are the ignorant ones. Windows is not a homebrew OS. Its meant for everyone from grandma's to businesses. To me its not ignorant to be pissed off when your workflow is messed with. It would be IF the new way is markedly better. Windows 8's way is not. Worse still the UI is not intuitive. This is being proven by the real world. Otherwise this new and shiny OS would be selling like hotcakes.

FYI- I have more experience in the computer field than you do. I have more certifications than you. I also have more schooling than you. So if you want to go down that road...you will lose pup - and lose badly.
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Old January 14, 2014, 06:20 PM
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People whined when Vista came out because it was radically different at the time compared to XP. Then Windows 7 launches and suddenly people fall in love and claim it's the best thing ever, when really it was a very minor deviation from Vista. There was some tweaks to the UI and some tweaks in the kernel, but nothing noteworthy I'd say.

It's going to be no different here. Windows 8.x is just the negative feedback release, Windows 9 will largely be the same, yet people will somehow love it.
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Old January 14, 2014, 07:09 PM
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Originally Posted by JD View Post
People whined when Vista came out because it was radically different at the time compared to XP. Then Windows 7 launches and suddenly people fall in love and claim it's the best thing ever, when really it was a very minor deviation from Vista. There was some tweaks to the UI and some tweaks in the kernel, but nothing noteworthy I'd say.

It's going to be no different here. Windows 8.x is just the negative feedback release, Windows 9 will largely be the same, yet people will somehow love it.
I will agree, I didnt mind Vista other than a few hardware issues and craptastic performance issues (USB I am looking at you) but SP1 solved most of the issues I had at the time. 7 was what Vista should have been from the start, I said it then and I still say it now. That said I have used 8.0 and hate it with a burning passion, dont even get me started on how less tech savoy fam/dam thinks about it, think of a 68 year old mom in law that thinks the internet is a giant E on her desktop now take everything she knows and intro metro, yeah win8 lasted I think 3 days on her new laptop. Change is good when implemented right obviously it wasnt or there would never have been the hate for 8.0, all this as stated could have been thought out much better by a simple desktop style gui and a Metro gui.
Ever since ME and then XP I have been convinced that MS is in a Tick/Tock cycle.

8.1 I have not even tried, while I do read and see that a variety of concerns have been changed, 7 is working just fine on all my rigs and will continue to unless 9 offers me that "Tock".

I am just happy that as a community here @ HWC we finally got curt off XP.
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Old January 14, 2014, 07:21 PM
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Just gunna put this here...
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Old January 14, 2014, 07:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JD View Post
People whined when Vista came out because it was radically different at the time compared to XP. Then Windows 7 launches and suddenly people fall in love and claim it's the best thing ever, when really it was a very minor deviation from Vista. There was some tweaks to the UI and some tweaks in the kernel, but nothing noteworthy I'd say.

It's going to be no different here. Windows 8.x is just the negative feedback release, Windows 9 will largely be the same, yet people will somehow love it.
I said that a few posts back and it was scoffed at.

As for the app thing... really?

Windows key + R - update. Problem solved. Been that way since the beginning.

AKG - curious, how would you know what experience/education I have? Or do you have a number of PhD and MBA's and have written literally every book on the subject making you the number authority on the subject. I figure that must be it since you must be what, 60-70 to make the assumption im a "pup"

If so, could you link me your master thesis and dissertations so I could skim over it? Always interested in seeing another's original research.
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