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  #11 (permalink)  
Old August 28, 2008, 02:33 PM
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3.0 "I kill SR2's" Charlie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dizz View Post
Hi 3.0charlie, to be honest it not that the budgets small, it's just that I love to get the biggest band for the smallest bucks!

Therefore I would have to say a Q6600 paired with a P45 chipset my enclosures are all workstation rigs; storage down one side & on the other side of the partition is the M/B & system components, needless to say lots of room for water, which I have been considering for a while.

However does the Performance/Temperature equation justify the move from Air to Water?
Your thoughts are very welcome!

Regards, Dizz
Water-cooling allows for a quieter operation of the computer, but is mainly used to allow a high level of oc'ing - and a water-cool system with a Quad as a CPU is the Best-bang-for-the-buck setup you can have.

Now, parts. I did too start with a Koolance setup as my first wc'ing rig, an Exos II. But in all honesty, a custom-built system is the way to go. If you wish to start with the CPU, here's what you need (with expansion in mind):

Apogee GTX block for the CPU
Swiftech MCR-220 radiator
Swiftech MCP-655 pump
Swiftech Micro-Reservoir
7/16" Primochill Pro tubing
Swiftech Radbox to install the radiator on the backside of the case (if needed)
2 Scythe SFF21F fans, for the Radiator.

It's a start.
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  #12 (permalink)  
Old August 28, 2008, 04:25 PM
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Thanks cwestwell & 3.0charlie, I will definitely look into water for my next build & will take your respective comments under advisement. Since no one is suggesting any other Motherboards or commenting that the escalation in temperature is unusual, I think I have indirect had my primary enquiry answered.


If I interpret all of this correct for “Q6600 - 24/7 full load – Low Temps & stable” you either keep your VCore low such as mine & settle with 3.2/3.4 GHz on Air. Or you address the resultant escalation in temperatures from VCore increases with water cooling.

OK, so if I consider 55-60 degrees Celsius as my “Temperature Ceiling” & use water to cool my CPU, NB & SB; would 4 GHz (500x8) be an unreasonable expectation? And if this is my goal (500x8) surely I can’t be on the right motherboard? From all accounts Asus P5Q-Pro has a FSB ceiling of about 475!


Therefore, should I not be seeking a better CPU/Motherboard combination? Is the Q6600 still the right Quad-Core for the job, logic tells me that the Asus P5Q-Pro defiantly is not! If chasing 4 GHZ “24/7 full load – Low Temps & stable” involves an X48 chipset & a 9 series Quad-Core, then perhaps I have already hit the “Sweet Spot”?


Sorry for all the questions, and please know that everyone’s assistance to-date is very much appreciated. Any last thoughts or experiences would still be very welcome.


Regards, Dizz
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MoBo:
Asus P5Q-Pro
OS: WinXP Pro_SP3

CPU: Q6600 - 3.6GHz 8x450 - 24/7 Stable
VCore: 1.45v - BIOS Setting
HSF: Ultra 120 with NF-P12 Fan x 2
Temp: TCase 41c Hotest Tj 62c

GPU: HIS IceQ3 Turbo HD3870
Temp: Celcius 29-36 Degrees - Idle
Disp: Dual 19" Standard 1280x1024

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  #13 (permalink)  
Old August 28, 2008, 04:34 PM
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3.0 "I kill SR2's" Charlie
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Oh My. 4.0 with any Quad (except the QX9650) is difficult to achieve. The load on the board is huge, and the demand fo high voltage all around is there. The highest I managed on a Quad is 3.85GHz (24/7 folder), using a Gigabyte GA-P35C-DS3R board - chip was under water too.
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  #14 (permalink)  
Old August 28, 2008, 05:00 PM
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Thanks 3.0charlie, if others respond in kind, then this very much confirms my VCore/Temperature experiments with the Q6600; considering my usage & stability parameters, I might just get another Asus P5Q-Pro & cool it with water.


In reality water is no more expensive than “Silent Air” in a large Workstation enclosure & if GPU temperatures don’t reverse their current trend we will all need water cooling & our own private power stations just to run our graphics cards.


Thank you once again for your input!



Many thanks, Dizz
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MoBo:
Asus P5Q-Pro
OS: WinXP Pro_SP3

CPU: Q6600 - 3.6GHz 8x450 - 24/7 Stable
VCore: 1.45v - BIOS Setting
HSF: Ultra 120 with NF-P12 Fan x 2
Temp: TCase 41c Hotest Tj 62c

GPU: HIS IceQ3 Turbo HD3870
Temp: Celcius 29-36 Degrees - Idle
Disp: Dual 19" Standard 1280x1024

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  #15 (permalink)  
Old August 29, 2008, 08:02 AM
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Yeah 4.0 is a tough one you wont hit that one with the Q6600 unless you could somehow get your board to run 445X9 which is unlikely but I wont say impossible but highly unlikely with any consumer level cooling. I was able to get my Q6600 to 3.0 Ghz on air very easily and with only a 4-6 degree change in core temps however once I started pushing it to 3.2 and higher the voltage went up and the temps started getting way to high for any stable testing. However under water I was able to get a stable 3.6 I know if you got a good q6600 you can hit 3.8 but I never tried past 3.6 it started getting tricky. All of this is on the ASUS Maximus Formula which was an awesome board at an great price however now EOL so the next closest board that has an X series chipset is the Rampage which for all the reading ive done is basically the MAX FORM only newer and with a few tweeks.
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  #16 (permalink)  
Old August 29, 2008, 04:25 PM
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Hi cwestwell, yes it seems that Quads have a very specific point at which temperatures begin to escalate rapidly. While I’m a little surprised to discover how distinct that point is, I’m not at all disappointed with getting real-world performances gains of between 35-44% with temps lower than stock.


Regardless, as I said earlier I will go with water for my next build & have already started doing the research. On that point unless Asus includes a Thermal Shutdown feature in a future BIOS update I won’t be using a P5Q-Pro; warning bells are great if your home but my Workstations are on 24/7 even if I’m on holidays. So a “BIOS Level Thermal Shutdown Feature” would seem to be my first priority? I need a Chernobyl in my absents like I need a hole in the head!


Thanks for your Motherboard suggestions I had a look at both the ASUS Maximus Formula (X38) & the Rampage Formula (x48) & if my Workstations were more gaming orientated the Rampage Formula (x48) would be very attractive. However, both boards are twice the price of a suitable P45 motherboard & in my case don’t offer any additional functionality. When I do spend premium dollars on a Motherboard it’s because it offers advantages such as (SCSI 320 RAID), (SAS RAID), (Fully Complaint PCI-X Slots) or (Multiple Independent PCI-Ex8 Slots) needless to say they are almost always Dual Socket Motherboards & prices are always exorbitant.


Thankfully, at this point in time we are trying to migrate at least some of our Workstations away from the fore named storage connectivity & are seeking more affordable solutions; having said that I am finding consumer level RAID somewhat disconcerting. If ICH-10 is a fair reflection of consumer level RAID then I may very well have to review our current Motherboard choices anyway & X48 may become attractive because of it multiple PCI-E x16 slots (only need x8), then we can return to Professional RAID with Areca RAID Cards.


I hope I didn’t digress too much & I want to once again thank you & everyone else here that has contributed, your input has been most useful.


Kindest Regards, Dizz
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MoBo:
Asus P5Q-Pro
OS: WinXP Pro_SP3

CPU: Q6600 - 3.6GHz 8x450 - 24/7 Stable
VCore: 1.45v - BIOS Setting
HSF: Ultra 120 with NF-P12 Fan x 2
Temp: TCase 41c Hotest Tj 62c

GPU: HIS IceQ3 Turbo HD3870
Temp: Celcius 29-36 Degrees - Idle
Disp: Dual 19" Standard 1280x1024

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  #17 (permalink)  
Old August 29, 2008, 05:45 PM
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U should be able to do 3.6GHz on air with a high-end air cooler such as the Thermalright Ultra 120 Extreme, Scythe Infinity, Ninja, etc.

I'm doing 3.8GHz on my Q9450 (475 x 8) right now.
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old August 29, 2008, 08:30 PM
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Charlies got it bang on but i would put those Noctua P-12's on your rad instead of those Scythe first you already have the fans im currently running 6 on a triple rad and their silent but i shouldnt tell you as you are running 9 on yours. Anyways the Noctuas are perfect fans for the swiftech rads so enjoy everything else hes said is what i did on my first water cooling project.
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old August 31, 2008, 06:33 AM
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I have overclocked the system I have mention in sig. I managed to get the chip up to 1333 FSB @ 3.0 on stock air. I can tell right now that IM gonna need a aftermarket cooling solution coz my fans are spinning up and down every time my WCG agent tekes my 50% cut of the CPU. I am very pleased with the performance right now. 1333 I think is very respectable considering im not running like a POWER 5 or 6 platform. It is FAST, very fast, considering the majority of the GOV and the MIL is running what is known to be stable, and thats P3 atm. Even most respectable server farms wont go breaking edge tech unless its PROVEN to be stable.
So, unless I crash in the next two monts, im gonna recommend a x48 gigabyte base mobo to all my IT freinds that wanna upgrade a high performance server. TO bad that that the gigabytes arent that popular.
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  #20 (permalink)  
Old September 2, 2008, 04:44 PM
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Hi all, I what to start by saying thanks to everyone, so a big THANKS from me to all!


Anyway, I have decided to push the boundaries a little further. I’ve been running “24/7 Full Load, Stable” for the last 2 days at the following settings.
[3.552MHz (444x8) - VCore 1.45v –CPU Temps 40-45c - Memory Ratio 1:1]


In order to keep the CPU Temps in check I reconfigured my “Thermalright Ultra 120 Extreme” with two Noctua NF-P12s in a Push-Pull. In addition I put a 40mm “Scythe Mini-Kaze” fan on the NB Chipset & those Temps are now stable at around 35-40c.


At these new settings my CPU Temps are virtually identical to a Standards Intel HSF @ Full Load; however I have real-world performances gains of between 40-52%, so I’m understandable delighted. It’s still a little premature to declare these settings as “24/7 Full Load, Stable” but it’s looking very good.


I have to say that the Asus P5Q-Pro – Intel Q6600 & Thermalright Ultra 120 Extreme in Noctua NF-P12 Push-Pull, has proved to be an excellent combination. The Physical fitting required no mods, the Temperature/Performance Scaling is excellent & the component costs were very affordable. And the fact that a “Scythe Mini-Kaze” 40mm fan slips easily on to the NB is just the icing on the cake.


Anyway, I hope this information proves useful to someone.


Regards, Dizz
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________________
MoBo:
Asus P5Q-Pro
OS: WinXP Pro_SP3

CPU: Q6600 - 3.6GHz 8x450 - 24/7 Stable
VCore: 1.45v - BIOS Setting
HSF: Ultra 120 with NF-P12 Fan x 2
Temp: TCase 41c Hotest Tj 62c

GPU: HIS IceQ3 Turbo HD3870
Temp: Celcius 29-36 Degrees - Idle
Disp: Dual 19" Standard 1280x1024


Last edited by Dizz; September 3, 2008 at 02:54 PM.
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