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  #11 (permalink)  
Old March 16, 2011, 01:33 AM
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Comparing Canadian prices to UK isn't useful I'm afraid. We have 20% "Value Added Tax" on stuff sold in the UK, and that puts the prices up. Unfortunately, components here are more expensive than across the pond! That's just the way it is.

Very useful comments all round, will take it all into consideration. Thanks!
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  #12 (permalink)  
Old March 16, 2011, 01:47 AM
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rightfully said. over there anything computer related costs more. i bought the same webcam here for 30 bucks vs there 40'sh, those are average prices

theres only 2 ways you can go at it,if you go intel. i3 530/540+oc on 1156 or i5 2500k on 1155. nothing in between, unless you dont care for overclocking than the 2400 will do as well.
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Old March 16, 2011, 05:39 AM
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Don't waste the money on an intel platform. AMD offers FAR better bang for the buck. My AMD 555 BE unlocked to a Quad and is running 3.5GHz OC'd. On my side of the pond, I paid just over $500 for my board, CPU, ram and video card and it rocks. A comparible Intel PC would have been $100+ more and only 2 CPU cores. Stop looking at Intel. They are marginally better at some things and no better at gaming. They just cost more.
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  #14 (permalink)  
Old March 16, 2011, 06:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by b1lk1 View Post
. They are marginally better at some things and no better at gaming. They just cost more.
Have to agree, But I can figure out how to use a AMD...LOL
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Old March 16, 2011, 07:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Chromey View Post
Have to agree, But I can figure out how to use a AMD...LOL
It is a processor. How hard can it be to use it LOL

Sandy Bridge does offer good price/performance currently but I'm hoping that AMD Bulldozer might just give some significant competition to Intel to either drive Intel's prices down or offer an alternative to Sandy Bridge. I am missing AMD already. Why are they making me wait till June
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Old March 16, 2011, 08:43 AM
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Originally Posted by b1lk1 View Post
Don't waste the money on an intel platform. AMD offers FAR better bang for the buck. My AMD 555 BE unlocked to a Quad and is running 3.5GHz OC'd. On my side of the pond, I paid just over $500 for my board, CPU, ram and video card and it rocks. A comparible Intel PC would have been $100+ more and only 2 CPU cores. Stop looking at Intel. They are marginally better at some things and no better at gaming. They just cost more.
Did you see the build I put up for him? That build stomps any AMD in it's pricerange... I used to be an AMD fanboy but sandy bridge is just way too good for AMD to compete right now until they launch bulldozer.

I'm afraid the i5 2500k outperforms every amd 4 core processor and there is no need to get a 6 core processor.
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Old March 16, 2011, 04:09 PM
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Originally Posted by JJThomp View Post
Did you see the build I put up for him? That build stomps any AMD in it's pricerange... I used to be an AMD fanboy but sandy bridge is just way too good for AMD to compete right now until they launch bulldozer.

I'm afraid the i5 2500k outperforms every amd 4 core processor and there is no need to get a 6 core processor.
well duh, SB even beats intel's older more expensive lineup which already beat AMD's best...thing is a decent mobo+2500k (the only 1 worth getting for gamers imo) costs 3-4x the cost of a perfectly fine AMD cpu+mobo...and most games wont see a good performance boost to extra money spent ratio at at resolutions that matter (ofc at 720p any decent gpu can pump out hundreds of fps and the cpu becomes the bottleneck but who cares when the deciding factor is at 1080p+)

If ur gona play only at 720p get a cheap cpu/gpu that will do 720p just fine around 60-70fps and cost like 400$ (thats like 230 pounds or something) heck even my 500$ laptop can play bfbc2/sc2 maxed out on 720p at 50-60fps...

if ur gona spend 950$ (600pounds) for a gaming PC, spend that money on getting the maximum image quality at 60fps not maximum fps at a given setting if u know what I mean...
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Old March 16, 2011, 07:26 PM
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Originally Posted by BrutalGreen View Post
well duh, SB even beats intel's older more expensive lineup which already beat AMD's best...thing is a decent mobo+2500k (the only 1 worth getting for gamers imo) costs 3-4x the cost of a perfectly fine AMD cpu+mobo...and most games wont see a good performance boost to extra money spent ratio at at resolutions that matter (ofc at 720p any decent gpu can pump out hundreds of fps and the cpu becomes the bottleneck but who cares when the deciding factor is at 1080p+)

If ur gona play only at 720p get a cheap cpu/gpu that will do 720p just fine around 60-70fps and cost like 400$ (thats like 230 pounds or something) heck even my 500$ laptop can play bfbc2/sc2 maxed out on 720p at 50-60fps...

if ur gona spend 950$ (600pounds) for a gaming PC, spend that money on getting the maximum image quality at 60fps not maximum fps at a given setting if u know what I mean...
Okay a decent AMD build would cost about $80 less but if it is in your budget you should always go for Sandy Bridge... Sandy bridge is the best bang for your buck out there... If you want to play new RTS (say SCII) games on high settings the better the processor the better your framrates will be. If the person was playing FPS then maybe you want a worse processor and better GPU but SB is the way to go in this case.

The extra $90 you spend will increase the life of your computer and give you better performance whereas Phenom II is a dying build SB is on the up. You should get an extra year out of an SB build than any AMD right now performance wise which is well worth the money.
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old March 16, 2011, 08:39 PM
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2500k = 220$
vs
955BE = 120$

cheapest decent 2xpcie16 p67 board = 165$
vs
cheapest decent 2xpcie16 am3 board = 65$

my friends i7 950 @4ghz gets 71C burn under a Noctua NH-D14 = 90$
vs
my 955BE @4ghz getting 47C burn under an OCZ Vendetta 2 = 15$
(not gona consider the thermal difference since yes it is true an i7 is more powerful at 4ghz than a phenom but point is that power is not needed for hardcore gaming)

thats 200$ more (a single PNY gtx 560ti is currently going at 200$ at NCIX and of course I'm speaking of Canadian prices as I know how much things go for here not in GB)

Yes SC2 is a very CPU demanding game, but a 955BE although alot weaker than the 2500k wont ever be so weak as to bottleneck the GPU to the point where FPS would drop under 60fps where the GPU could actually do better. Yes in scenarios were ur running the game at 1280x720 and u have massive GPU power the 955 WILL be ur bottleneck but keep in mind even with a budget gamer's GPU like the 560ti you are going to be doing 70-80fps at this resolution (yes if ur running a 2x 560sli like me u will be getting like 80fps on the phenom vs like 200+ on the i5 but this doesnt matter as 80fps is still very playable and some1 with 2x 560sli would probably be playing at like 2560x1600ish where the difference between the phenom and the i5 will be only a few fps).

Thing is when u push higher resolutions even the slower CPUs have to hold back w8ing on the GPUs to render the frames, and this is precisely why you can see a much wider gap between cheaper and more expensive CPUs at lower resolutions where the GPUs have no issue pumping out millions of frames but the lower end CPUs can't do the calculations for the game as fast as the CPUs giving the systems with more expensive CPUs a huge advantage. But as soon as you hit the point where the image quality is high enough for fps to be limited by the GPU, it doesnt matter how fast your CPU can do the calculations when ur GPU cant render more that Xfps.

Now im not saying good CPUs are not needed for gaming, as a matter of fact I built my friends i7 choosing all the components for him according to his budget. The key word here is budget. With 950$ you have enough money to build a system worthy of playing all current titles maxed out on 1080p! But to achieve that an extra 200$ in gpu department would do you much more good than in the CPU department. But if you are like my friend who spent 2.5k on his battle station after a certain amount of money ditched at the GPUs (3x5870s in his case) the benefits become marginal and you are better off investing more into a better CPU.

what I'm trying to say here is that the 2500k is a great SB chip and would make for a great build, but for the purpose of this build (gaming) going from a 100$ GPU to 300$ would get him much more for his money than getting a SB over an AM3!

Not exactly same senario but u get the just of it (965BE getting very similar results to the much more powerful i7 on higher resolution):


But GPU scaling within the prices permitted here scales beautifully (100$ 5770 vs 250$ 6950 effectively increasing fps by 2.5x):


P.S. and off topic: going for SB on a cheap mATX board is just such a sad waste in my opinion in a mid-tower gaming build
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  #20 (permalink)  
Old March 17, 2011, 08:17 AM
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You are still forgetting that he is playing an RTS where the GPU will sit idle and the CPU will do all the work and unless you OC the 955 BE it will be the bottleneck. Also it's not like I gave him a bad GPU a 6850 is pretty solid at 1920x1080/1200. For what his purposes are the GPU you are giving him is overkill.

Again is a phenom II good enough? Yes
Is an i5 2500k better? Yes

At the end of the day the customer is getting a better build for his purposes. The customer is not an FPS player therefore GPU's take the back seat.

Also notice in your charts all the top cards (gtx 560 ti+) are bottlenecked by the CPU.

Also you don;t spend $1000 on a computer and then $500 on a monitor there is no chance he is running that high.

Last edited by JJThomp; March 17, 2011 at 10:26 AM.
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