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Old September 10, 2013, 08:28 PM
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Well actually LG had 120 IPS panels but have from what I have heard stopped making the 120 version and stepped down to 60 as the yields were not great. Sasmung wont as they have gone for the inferior image quality PLS tech. IE its mainly an engineering issue, but since the marketshare is not big enough...its a pipe dream of mine. In all likelihood it indeed will be PLS - or maybe OLED. Just depends on which company (LG or Sammy) see the need and put more money into RnD than the other 'team'.
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Old September 10, 2013, 09:28 PM
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Originally Posted by SKYMTL View Post
The issue really comes down to technology. AH-IPS simply doesn't have the backbone to run at 120Hz constant. PLS panels? Maybe.
So, no overdriving this panel at all?
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Old September 11, 2013, 05:09 AM
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Sure, you can overdrive it, but don't expect 120Hz.
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Old September 11, 2013, 05:20 AM
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Booo! I tried overclocking my Samsung Syncmaster 2443 last night. End result? Not a single iota of an increase :(.

I was looking for a lightboost monitor at some point anyway (but only because 27-30" high resolution monitors are out of my grasp financially).
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  #25 (permalink)  
Old September 11, 2013, 08:46 AM
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Originally Posted by SKYMTL View Post
Snake oil FTW!

I do a whole lot of gaming and in 95% of situations, I'd take resolution and 60Hz over 120Hz and lower resolution any day of the week.


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Originally Posted by AkG View Post
I have a laugh when I see anyone rave about 120hz gaming these days. Obviously they have never tried a high quality monitor.

I own the 140Hz Asus 27" 1080P lightboost monitor. I used the 144Hz Asus. The one I always opt for to play games on....is my Dell. If I had the coin I would have sold my nearly new U2713H and gotten this 30 inch beast. Its at a different level than even the 27H. IMHO color pallet and clarity of images will ALWAYS beat out shear frames per second.
It's not the 120hz that is better, it is the zero motion blur that the lightboost hack has brought to the table. It's not 60hz, it's crappy pixel refresh that is well documented in the Lightboost thread that sucks on an LCD. You young fella's must have never gamed on a CRT before You're used to the choppy crap you've been fed all these years. I'll grant that 2560x1440 IPS is probably better for RTS, but I've made my opinion of that glorified rock paper scissors genre known in another thread.
I'm an ex team warfare ladder champion in both Quake 3 and UT3 low grav instagib. Those were the days with a ball mouse and a CRT. UNSTOPPABLE! Somehow I got used to LCD's but it was never the same. Now I'm in Nirvana again, pwning noobs and doing their Mom's.

To each his own, luckily I'm always right.
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Old September 11, 2013, 09:02 AM
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If you think motion blurr is making that much of a difference in online games...well that is about as good an example of snake oil as I have ever seen. Online gaming its all about PING TIMES. You are obviously a LPB going up against peeps with worse ping times.

I grew up with CRTs. Are they superior in refresh rate. Yes. Its night and day. But we can agree to disagree on what is most important to gaming enjoyment. You feel seeing every crappily rendered TN pixel in pristine condition is most important. I think overall color pallet, color depth and overall color fidelity -even with some blurr - is more important. Considering many games come with 'motion blur' built into their engines...well I will let you draw your own conclusions on what the majority of publishers (ie the people who make their money from meeting the majority of peoples needs) feel is more important. :)~

Seriously though, as I said earlier I cant wait for high quality 120Hz monitors to come out so that TN can be pushed to the value end of the marketplace....where it belongs.
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Old September 11, 2013, 10:48 AM
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I am in Canada and frequently had worse pings than most other peeps.
Here's a simple test. Open any FPS, stand close to wall with a poster on it and strafe side to side with the keyboard. With a 60hz LCD you cannot read the text, it washes right out does not matter how good the response rate is. This gets worse with mouse movement. You can't hit what you can't see. I can game for hours on my lightboost monitor with no fatigue. My brain goes squirrelly trying to make sense of the garble that is on a 60hz LCD.
I sold my U2711 days after I got my lightboost. After side by side comparisons too. Because the 120hz is perfectly fine for normal use and a 1000x better for gaming. The only thing an IPS is good for is static images. During my normal workload or browsing I am panning objects or scrolling websites or documents. Very little is static about computer use.
If you think a 60hz ips is good for fast motion gaming then you are brainwashed. It is good enough at best.
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Old September 11, 2013, 01:05 PM
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No you miss my point. Lets first assume you have the GPU power to max both out. So 60 fps is 1/60 of a second or about 17ms refresh rate (0.01666666 of a second). 120fps is 1/120 of a second or about 8ms refresh rate (0.0083333). So you are in a bad area with crap ping times. On my first ISP it was in the 120 range. On my other ISP (yes I had two. one for gaming...one for not) its in the 20 range. Thats five to twelve frames in the difference between a good connection and a bad. Thats 5-12 frames that you CAN NOT see anything that is happening as the data is not being updated any faster than that. Do you really think any blur from your monitor will make jack all difference in online gaming or do you think you will be 'p0wned' by a low ping bastard? IE From a competive persptive...its snake oil. As a "ex team warfare ladder champion in both Quake 3 and UT3 low grav instagib" you should know better.

Also have you actually used a modern IPS monitor or are you talking out your ass again enab? Like I said I did A/B testing as I have both here and A) know how to eliminate variables and B) have enough horsepower to max both out (dual 780s). Yes there is motion blur. Yes the TN is faster. But TN monitors images are terrible. Dotpitch, resolution and color fidelity play just as big if not larger role in gaming enjoyment for most consumers. I personally will never go back to 8bit 1080P gaming. In a perfect world we will have 120Hz 10bit IPS/PLS/etc panels and this debate will be moot. Will we ever have 10bit TN 120fps panels? Doubtful. Tn is low image quality only. Do I think there is a place where TN is superior? Yes. Do I think most people will benefit from these edge examples? No. Most will be better served with a high resolution, high image quality modern IPS or PLS display. Can I see the other side of the argument? Yes. YMMV :)
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old September 11, 2013, 02:39 PM
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One thing I think is being lost in translation here is that Lightboost DOES NOT increase refresh rate.
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Old September 11, 2013, 03:21 PM
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No you miss my point. Lets first assume you have the GPU power to max both out. So 60 fps is 1/60 of a second or about 17ms refresh rate (0.01666666 of a second). 120fps is 1/120 of a second or about 8ms refresh rate (0.0083333). So you are in a bad area with crap ping times. On my first ISP it was in the 120 range. On my other ISP (yes I had two. one for gaming...one for not) its in the 20 range. Thats five to twelve frames in the difference between a good connection and a bad. Thats 5-12 frames that you CAN NOT see anything that is happening as the data is not being updated any faster than that. Do you really think any blur from your monitor will make jack all difference in online gaming or do you think you will be 'p0wned' by a low ping bastard? IE From a competive persptive...its snake oil. As a "ex team warfare ladder champion in both Quake 3 and UT3 low grav instagib" you should know better.
Let's agree to disagree about image quality vs. motion smoothness.

But from this statement it is evident that you know jack all about net code. That statement is dead wrong.

You equate latency (lag) with frequency(data rate) here. That is totally wrong. The time it takes the server to receive data has nothing to do with the amount of data it is receiving.
You are stating that a ping of 120ms is a receive rate of 1 frame of data in every 120ms. When it is actually a constant stream (however often that netcode is designed to update player actions and movement called the tick rate, you can tweak this if you have more bandwidth, most online netcode uses 15ms or 66.66 FPS, I jacked mine to 100 in the console) of data only it is 120ms behind real time. In addition to this, they use interpolation and other means of compensation to try and equal out and smooth out online game play.

Your analogy would turn online gaming into an unplayable slideshow and we would never have gotten past Quake 1 before people thought it sucked.

Now in addition to this, Me and most other top FPS peeps know that ping is over rated and used as an excuse. I'll prove it to you, go here:

Human Benchmark - Reaction Time Test

Test your reaction times. Tell me you can get under 200ms and I'll be impressed. This is pretty much worse than a high ping server. So lag be damned, whoever gets off first wins most battles.

In order to get off first you need to see first and shoot first. This is where smooth motion is critical. You whip a 180 with your mouse and everything washes out, it takes time for your brain to sort out this mess as it comes back into focus. I whip a 180 and I've got the guy spotted as soon as he comes into the frame and I'm already bringing my crosshairs around to his brain bucket. Dead guy.

Also, motion blur is an actual film effect caused by 30 fps and slow shutters. Not at all how we see the world. It got put into games to make crappy LCDs seem all hollywood. I turn that shit off first thing in the options.

So, you can go ahead and admire your pretty still image while you are waiting to respawn.
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