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Old April 18, 2009, 06:39 AM
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Default Samsung 305T (plus) and fine color works

Gentlemen,

Have anybody an experience with Samsung 305T (plus) and fine color works?
I mean Photoshop and CAD applications.
I dream to get 30 inch monitor for fine CAD and graphical color works,
but I'm afraid I can see an excessive color shifting effect (305T is based on S-PVA, non S-IPS panel).
So, could anybody comment if 305T color shift effect is acceptable for Photoshop works or not?
And second thing - what about tiredness of eyes when we're working with 305T?
Especially when we're working with text or with big white surfaces at ArchiCAD diagrams etc.
I know it's real big issue for many types of monitors, firstly for monitors based on LG.Philips S-IPS/H-IPS panels -
there we can see a discomfort sparkling at big homogeneous white surfaces and such visual effect provokes an eyes tiredness quickly.
any comments, considerations about Samsung 305T (plus) will be very appreciated!
Thanks a lot in advance!

Anatoly

Last edited by SA-SFT fun; April 18, 2009 at 06:45 AM.
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Old April 18, 2009, 03:02 PM
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Umm, if your that serious about LCDs, you shouldn't be looking at such "off the shelf" brands IMO.

I forget what company it is though, but they make some really, really high end LCDs and then even have hoods on them to block out ambient light.

And BTW, welcome to our Canadian forums.
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Old April 18, 2009, 03:11 PM
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Originally Posted by jdrom17 View Post
Umm, if your that serious about LCDs, you shouldn't be looking at such "off the shelf" brands IMO.

I forget what company it is though, but they make some really, really high end LCDs and then even have hoods on them to block out ambient light.

And BTW, welcome to our Canadian forums.
Is this the company you're thinking of; LaCie - LCD Monitors

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Old April 18, 2009, 03:42 PM
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Is this the company you're thinking of; LaCie - LCD Monitors

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Old April 18, 2009, 03:47 PM
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Hello Mr. jdrom17,

I think you say about Hi-End prof monitors from EIZO, LaCie or NEC's SpectraView Line.
My budget is no more than 2000 USD and I'd like to find something with best volume for money... :)
But the main my problem is not money (though money is quite essential thing :) ), my main issue is my very sensitive eyes...
I need real quality LCD, but don't like displays based on LG.Phillips S-IPS panel, because of so called 'crystal effect' -
a sparkling at big homogeneous white surfaces, it looks like surface of fresh snow at sunny day,
it's native incorrigible nature of LG.Phillips S-IPS panels. That is why I can't use generally nice LCD based on S-IPS from LG.Philips
However there is absolutely perfect S-IPS based LCD - NEC2190Uxi and I already use it.
This LCD is based on own NEC panel, so called SA-SFT panel, it's NEC's version of S-IPS technology,
but NEC uses own panels only at 21" LCD and nowhere more... Now I need 30" LCD
So I have to think about 30" S-PVA based displays, and the first brand-name here is Samsung, isn't it?
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Old April 18, 2009, 04:02 PM
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Mr. Chilly,
I know you're ex-owner of Samsung 305T,
it would be very appreciated if you could comment something about color shifting and visual comfort,
I mean how big white surface is displaying? What about sparkling at white surface etc?
Thank you in advance.

P.S. It seems I have already found your answer for my question about the 305T color shifting.
And to all appearances 305T is not suitable for serious works with Picture Color Editing.
It's quite disappointing news...
You wrote about the color shifting issue:
Samsung 305T Review Comment Thread

Last edited by SA-SFT fun; April 18, 2009 at 04:53 PM.
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Old April 18, 2009, 06:26 PM
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Yeah those were all the companies...

I don't know but maybe the Dell UltraSharp?
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Old April 18, 2009, 06:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SA-SFT fun View Post
Mr. Chilly,
I know you're ex-owner of Samsung 305T,
it would be very appreciated if you could comment something about color shifting and visual comfort,
I mean how big white surface is displaying? What about sparkling at white surface etc?
Thank you in advance.

P.S. It seems I have already found your answer for my question about the 305T color shifting.
And to all appearances 305T is not suitable for serious works with Picture Color Editing.
It's quite disappointing news...
You wrote about the color shifting issue:
Samsung 305T Review Comment Thread
It has little to no "sparkle" on white surfaces, unlike the Dell 30" I currently have. It also strained my eyes when working with contrasting black gradients due to the colour shifting and crushed blacks.

Frankly if your looking for a QUALITY 30" LCD under $2000 USD, I would HIGHLY recommend the NEC 30" LCD3090WQXi, it uses an H-IPS instead of the S-IPS of most other 30" monitors, and it also seems to be less affected by the "sparkle" effect than other 30" monitors. I wish I had the budget for it back when I was buying up 30" monitors. If that's priced a little too high, I would also look at the HP 30" LP3065.

I personally ended up with a Dell 30" 3007WFP-HC(same *panel* quality as is in the Apple 30"), which unfortunately does suffer greatly from the "sparkle" effect, but I got used to it rather quickly, to the point where I no longer notice it.

NEC MultiSync LCD3090WQXi 30in Monitor Review - Display Reviews - TrustedReviews
HP LP3065 30in LCD Monitor Review - Display Reviews - TrustedReviews
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Last edited by Chilly; April 18, 2009 at 06:53 PM.
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Old April 18, 2009, 11:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chilly View Post
It has little to no "sparkle" on white surfaces, unlike the Dell 30" I currently have. It also strained my eyes when working with contrasting black gradients due to the colour shifting and crushed blacks.
Frankly if your looking for a QUALITY 30" LCD under $2000 USD, I would HIGHLY recommend the NEC 30" LCD3090WQXi, it uses an H-IPS instead of the S-IPS of most other 30" monitors, and it also seems to be less affected by the "sparkle" effect than other 30" monitors. I wish I had the budget for it back when I was buying up 30" monitors. If that's priced a little too high, I would also look at the HP 30" LP3065.
I personally ended up with a Dell 30" 3007WFP-HC(same *panel* quality as is in the Apple 30"), which unfortunately does suffer greatly from the "sparkle" effect, but I got used to it rather quickly, to the point where I no longer notice it.
Thank you, Chilly, for your comments and considerations. So I try to summarize.
Samsung 305T has just little sparkling white and it's really good, but its colour shifting is too clear visible, and it's not acceptable for me.

But I still have a dying hope - maybe be a colour shifting is not too visible. Chilly, could you kindly comment this issue once again? Is it really clearly visible issue?
I'll try to get to know whether I can't see deep black details when I look at 305T display strictly at right angle to? And is it true I'll need to look aslant to find black details? I assume that if I use Photoshop I use just half of screen direct for picture and I use other screen place to put many Photoshop's service panels... So, I believe I don't need to see a correct picture from left side to right side...

You wrote that Dell 3007WFP-HC has sparkle effect and it's really very worth info because HP3065 is based on the same S-IPS panel (I can be wrong, it needs to be checked).
Regarding NEC3090Wuxi, I'm afraid this LCD essentially sparkles too on white. Just recently I tried NEC 2490Wuxi and 2690Wuxi based on LG.Philips H-IPS panels.
These pretty nice displays have really "moderate" sparkle effect.
Nevertheless all the same NEC 2490/2690 "sparkle level" is not acceptable for me, because if you're working with ArchiCad (AutoCAD's little brother)
the working drawings have huge white surfaces as a background and you can go crazy from such pretty sparkling... :)
Moscow computer-guys call it as "crystal effect", this visual issue is well known here and it's being widely discussed.
By the way, NEC3090 Wuxi has fantastic price in Moscow - a little more than 3000 USD. My wife could kill me if I buy such expensive toy :)
Finally it seems there is the one possible way to provide absolutely perfect comfort display with huge working space -
to buy TWO NEC 2190 Uxi. Oh, Jesus Christ, could you help me !!!

Dear Chilly, I forgot to ask a couple of details about Samsung 305T plus:
1. What about noise ? (there are rumors Samsung 305T produces strange noise when it's working)
2. What about Wide Gamut, it's create some issue or not?
3. Samsung 305T has only two fixed heights - low position and low plus 3.5 inches. Is it enough to work comfortable?
Many thanks.

Last edited by SA-SFT fun; April 19, 2009 at 12:43 AM.
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Old April 19, 2009, 12:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SA-SFT fun View Post
Thank you, Chilly, for your comments and considerations. So I try to summarize.
Samsung 305T has just little sparkling white and it's really good, but its colour shifting is too clear visible, and it's not acceptable for me.

But I still have a dying hope - maybe be a colour shifting is not too visible. Chilly, could you kindly comment this issue once again? Is it really clearly visible issue?

You wrote that Dell 3007WFP-HC has sparkle effect and it's really very worth info because HP3065 is based on the same S-IPS panel (I can be wrong, it needs to be checked).
Regarding NEC3090Wuxi, I'm afraid this LCD essentially sparkles too on white. Just recently I tried NEC 2490Wuxi and 2690Wuxi based on LG.Philips H-IPS panels.
These pretty nice displays have really "moderate" sparkle effect.
Nevertheless all the same NEC 2490/2690 "sparkle level" is not acceptable for me, because if you're working with ArchiCad (AutoCAD's little brother)
the working drawings have huge white surfaces as a background and you can go crazy from such pretty sparkling... :)
Moscow computer-guys call it as "crystal effect", this visual issue is well known here and it's being widely discussed.
By the way, NEC3090 Wuxi has fantastic price in Moscow - a little more than 3000 USD. My wife could kill me if I buy such expensive toy :)
Finally it seems there is the one possible way to provide absolutely perfect comfort display with huge working space -
to buy TWO NEC 2190 Uxi. Oh, Jesus Christ, could you help me !!!

Dear Chilly, I forgot to ask a couple of details about Samsung 305T plus:
1. What about noise ? (there are rumors Samsung 305T produces strange noise when it's working)
2. What about Wide Gamut, it's create some issue or not?
3. Samsung 305T has only two fixed heights - low position and low plus 3.5 inches. Is it enough to work comfortable?
Many thanks.
Alright, lets start from the top

1. The colour shift was pretty bad for me BECAUSE of what I do, lots of graphics work and I noticed it quite badly, bad enough that I sold it and bought my current 30" Dell. With that said, I doubt very much that in "every day" use(documents, internet surfing, etc) that most people would notice it, but the second you start working with photos and etc, it becomes very distracting. This(colour shifting) is made worse due to the large size, it may not be noticeable, even for graphics work, on smaller size'ed monitors, I do not know.

Depending on your exact work, you may not notice it, but if you require colour accuracy, that alone should push you away, even if you cannot notice it.

2. Noise - Never heard any, never had any issue with this. Its been a while since I've owned the 305T, but I do not remember it creating any type of "strange" noises, seemed to be fairly silent to me in the time I owned it.

Speaking of Noises, the 30" Dell actually makes "snapping" noises from what seems to be regular thermal expansion and contraction, most likely from its flimsy build quality. I only mention this because the 30" Dell, while the panel inside of it is "High Quality" and the image it produces is great, the plastic they use to house the Monitor feels quite cheap for a monitor of this pricing. The Samsung on the other hand, felt bulletproof, it was extremely well build and the plastic they used felt of very high quality.

3. Wide Gamut - This shouldn't be an issue for you, as Auto-CAD(and most likely, your specific app), Photoshop, and etc are "colour managed". What this means is that these programs will actually take advantage of the Wide Gamut and show colours properly. The only issue you WILL encounter is the fact that the OS, Windows, OS X, Linux, are all NOT colour managed, this will cause any colours that they produce to seem a little like someone turned up the contrast, massively. Long story short, colours will be a little "strong" outside of colour managed applications.

Just as a note, Firefox IS colour managed so it will show websites and colours rendered properly.

Another note, chances are you will not really notice much of a difference outside these apps anyways, its a very subtle difference. What I'm trying to say is that outside "colour managed" applications, while colours will not be accurate, they will still look "normal", though a little more "vivid" than normal.

4. This depends on the part number, the 305T+ IS height adjustable. There are 2 revisions of the 305T, the 305T and the 305T Plus. The price is the same, and the panel is the same, but there are a few subtle difference such as the height adjustable. I don't believe you can buy the "old" 305T even if you wanted to but the part numbers are as follow: LS30HUBCB(305T without height adjustable stand), LS30HUXCB(305T+ with height adjustable stand)

Don't quote me on the above, but from personal experience AND what I read on the net, it seems accurate.

5. The panel that Dell 3007WFP-HC uses IS the same as the Apple 30" and the HP 30", and does have the same level of "sparkle effect". Like I said, *personally* its a very soft and tolerable level of sparkle in my uses. It may not at a level tolerable for you, but it is for me. As long as I turn down the brightness, I got used to it realistically quickly.

Just a final note, if you are to look at the S-IPS panel used in the Dell/Apple/HP, go with the HP/Apple, you'll be MUCH more happier with the external build quality/quality of the plastic molding of them when compared to the Dell. Even though the Image/Panel quality is the same, Dell leaves its external build quality much to be desired.

I hope that helps, and if not, feel free to ask me any more questions, I'd love to help.
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Last edited by Chilly; April 19, 2009 at 12:54 AM.
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