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  #91 (permalink)  
Old April 7, 2017, 08:58 AM
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https://www.pcper.com/news/Processor...Results-Inside

There might be hope yet. My biggest takeaway from that was that W10 disables core parking on Intel Processors with Speed Shift support so this stands a chance of leveling the playing field a bit.

edit: I probably shouldn't have used the phrase "There might be hope yet" as it implies that the status quo is less than ideal. What I probably should have commented on was the fact that it appears ongoing tweaks might have a real effect on the original benchmark numbers.
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Last edited by sswilson; April 7, 2017 at 09:24 AM.
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  #92 (permalink)  
Old April 7, 2017, 03:32 PM
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Originally Posted by sswilson View Post
https://www.pcper.com/news/Processor...Results-Inside

There might be hope yet. My biggest takeaway from that was that W10 disables core parking on Intel Processors with Speed Shift support so this stands a chance of leveling the playing field a bit.

edit: I probably shouldn't have used the phrase "There might be hope yet" as it implies that the status quo is less than ideal. What I probably should have commented on was the fact that it appears ongoing tweaks might have a real effect on the original benchmark numbers.
For those that use the Balanced Power plan. Is there even a site, which uses the Balanced Power plan to test any piece of hardware? Like any hardware release, it rarely goes 100% without a hitch. To see some of the e-tailer early adopter product reviews regarding Ryzen hardware is silly - complaining about poor RAM support or OC. Did none of them read any day-one reviews?

So far none of the issues are a game breaker and all of this will get ironed out. Even looking outside of price/performance Ryzen is an excellent piece of hardware.
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  #93 (permalink)  
Old April 7, 2017, 03:55 PM
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For those that use the Balanced Power plan. Is there even a site, which uses the Balanced Power plan to test any piece of hardware? Like any hardware release, it rarely goes 100% without a hitch. To see some of the e-tailer early adopter product reviews regarding Ryzen hardware is silly - complaining about poor RAM support or OC. Did none of them read any day-one reviews?

So far none of the issues are a game breaker and all of this will get ironed out. Even looking outside of price/performance Ryzen is an excellent piece of hardware.
I'd politefully disagree.

This is a professional company worth multi-billions. When Apple has a minor hiccup, we know about it. It's everywhere in the media, online, etc. AMD is putting out a retail channel product. I hate to use it, but cars are a great example. I can only imagine how people would feel if they could only roll their windows down half way, or only use shell gas, and only if it was 90 octane, or only get to a max of 65km/h.

Sure, cars have faults and get recalls. But for mainstream use of a retail channel object day 1 issues like GENERAL ram compatibility, power/performance setting issues, and BIOS problems should not be prevalent.
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Old April 7, 2017, 05:53 PM
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I'd politefully disagree.

This is a professional company worth multi-billions. When Apple has a minor hiccup, we know about it. It's everywhere in the media, online, etc. AMD is putting out a retail channel product. I hate to use it, but cars are a great example. I can only imagine how people would feel if they could only roll their windows down half way, or only use shell gas, and only if it was 90 octane, or only get to a max of 65km/h.

Sure, cars have faults and get recalls. But for mainstream use of a retail channel object day 1 issues like GENERAL ram compatibility, power/performance setting issues, and BIOS problems should not be prevalent.
Allow me to counter. The last two cars I have purchased have been brand new - different makes. One had (in my opinion) a major fault, which the dealership knew about and did not fix even though I had my car in for servicing, so I had to go in to have it fixed 3 days after and this was on top of other small constant "tweaks" by the dealership during servicing. The newer purchase had issues with the car not starting (no power), doors not closing properly. Both new cars had these issues within less than the first year due to cold temps (obvious global warming), which is not acceptable as the manufactures are professional companies worth multi-billions. Do they not test in cold climates? (Rhetorical, I know they do.)

And never mind the new Ford Mustang, a death trap and yet I don't see too many review organizations talking about it.

Continuing on, Lockheed F-22 Raptor (not even talking about the F-35). How much testing did they do: oxygen issue, cracks in the airframe, etc. Lockheed L-188 Electra, a passenger turboprop, where wings fell off due to harmonics killing all passenger in multiple flights (I am not even going to bring up the decades of Service Bulletins to fix various other critical/primary and non-critical structures), again has this professional multi-billion dollar company not done any testing?
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Old April 7, 2017, 06:57 PM
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Note: they can't sell the car if PDI is failed. Sometime the problem happens then service is free as warranty is. Sometime piece of shit happens.

That's why buying the new generation is almost bad idea so next time, "wait for 1 year" is the smart way to buy any products unless the company is awesome)


Annnd why discuss about airplane? o_O
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Old April 7, 2017, 07:34 PM
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Note: they can't sell the car if PDI is failed. Sometime the problem happens then service is free as warranty is. Sometime piece of shit happens.

That's why buying the new generation is almost bad idea so next time, "wait for 1 year" is the smart way to buy any products unless the company is awesome)


Annnd why discuss about airplane? o_O
I fail to see how your warranty comment adds to either my or Sagath's point(s) of argument? o_O If you care to argue a point using reason and evidence, by all means I welcome it.

As for using examples of failures in manufactured aircraft (unlike my anecdotal points about my car experiences), argues the point that no amount of reasonable testing can prevent end-user issues (due to limited data samples), regardless of company's market valuation or industry standing.
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Old April 7, 2017, 08:12 PM
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Originally Posted by EmptyMellon View Post
I fail to see how your warranty comment adds to either my or Sagath's point(s) of argument? o_O If you care to argue a point using reason and evidence, by all means I welcome it.

As for using examples of failures in manufactured aircraft (unlike my anecdotal points about my car experiences), argues the point that no amount of reasonable testing can prevent end-user issues (due to limited data samples), regardless of company's market valuation or industry standing.
Bingo.

Anecdotal reports are that. Anecdotal.

No amount of resonable testing can prevent everything, regardless of company worth. You're right. But if you list something as compatible day 1 of release, it probably should be, like perhaps ram, or windows compatibility with power settings. Specific examples of anecdotal problems are not what we're discussing. Much like oxygen problems on the f35 or your car not starting in cold weather, anecdotal facts are irrelevant. We all know and accept some failures happen. We're not discussing individual based 'unforeseen' factors. Unless you're arguing that AMD designed 3200 ram to not work with their CPU, and specifically was designed to fail in multi channels?

Problems of listed working ram speed not functioning across ALL spectrums isn't anecdotal, or 'limited' testing, it's a design level failure. Much like your new car failing to go in 1st gear, or the trunk to open on every model off the assembly line. Your facts are limited to small selections of failure points within a system. When every single retail item fails it is a design/system problem.
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Last edited by Sagath; April 7, 2017 at 08:20 PM.
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Old April 7, 2017, 08:52 PM
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Bingo.

Anecdotal reports are that. Anecdotal.

No amount of resonable testing can prevent everything, regardless of company worth. You're right. But if you list something as compatible day 1 of release, it probably should be, like perhaps ram, or windows compatibility with power settings. Specific examples of anecdotal problems are not what we're discussing. Much like oxygen problems on the f35 or your car not starting in cold weather, anecdotal facts are irrelevant. We all know and accept some failures happen. We're not discussing individual based 'unforeseen' factors. Unless you're arguing that AMD designed 3200 ram to not work with their CPU, and specifically was designed to fail in multi channels?

Problems of listed working ram speed not functioning across ALL spectrums isn't anecdotal, or 'limited' testing, it's a design level failure. Much like your new car failing to go in 1st gear, or the trunk to open on every model off the assembly line. Your facts are limited to small selections of failure points within a system. When every single retail item fails it is a design/system problem.
You make good points and I understand. However, the F-22 oxygen and structural failures were also system failures, they are not anecdotal, as I am pretty sure that the US military did not pay billions in contract fees to receive a gimped (and at points grounded) aircraft.

My point being, crap will get ironed out and I completely agree that a company's product should work out of the gate; otherwise nobody or very few (at best) would buy a product which works at 80% of its advertised performance.

Unless you work for a small custom shop, in a medium to large manufacturing company will always have issues when a product is released. As such, early adopters can complain all they want, but unless you try to create something of your own, mass produce it, market it and deliver it to consumers, you will not know the nightmares of being on the receiving end of the customers' complaints. Now, if you can prove willful negligence, that is a whole different story and I am pretty sure every publicly traded company tries to avoid that like a plague especially in this day and age of social media.
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