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Old August 28, 2010, 11:02 AM
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AkG, the simple fact here is that there is nothing actually wrong with this cooler.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lpfan4ever View Post
But buying something never opened from somebody poses the same risk as buying something unopened from retail, minus a nice comfy warranty. If it's absolutely imperative that a person gets something perfect, then stick to retail where you can get an exchange or refund. I personally think Crossfire has zero problems right now regarding this as everything regarding the condition of the cooler (Other than it being BNIB) is out of his hands.
Exactly.

If 0o0 had gone through normal retail channels he would have paid more in the end for a supposedly 100% item that could still have had the same issue. If, like now, he got one and was not happy with it then he would have to pay to send it back.(even though the cooler is fine and he will rarely ever see anything "wrong")
He still got a good deal compared to what the alternative is.

This whole situation is completely overblown.

Oh hey, 0o0, if you are really that unhappy with the cooler ya wanna mail that defective POC to me for cheap? ;)
  #32 (permalink)  
Old August 28, 2010, 11:36 AM
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Sure there is "nothing wrong with it" except it is not in 100% condition and the buyer was unhappy. Why is that so hard to understand that he is well within his rights to be unhappy. Id either offer to refund it upon return or give a slight rebate.

Sure he COULD have gone through retail and gotten a bad cooler as well. BUT you know what...ncix wouldnt be giving him hassle over it. If he explained to them the issue, I would be very surprised if they did anything other then say send it back and we will send a new one to you.

Did the seller sell it at below retail cost. Yes. He obviously thought a perfect condition prolima cooler was worth 55. Its not a perfect condition cooler. Its in "like new" condition. If the buyer wants to say it doesnt matter thats his right. BUT it is his reputation and not mine. Its also 0o0 right to give a bad itrader over it. Thats also how the real world works. You either fix the issue till the buyer is happy (or at least offer solutions that dont boil down to Piss Off or STFU n00b or etc etc etc)....or deal with having an unhappy customer. Im not saying offer a 100% rebate here, Im saying Id have said heres five bucks for your trouble or send it back and I will refund you your money. IF the buyer wanted more then 5 then yeah....my answer would be "NO. I will refund 100% upon return or give you 5 bucks, there is no third option."
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old August 28, 2010, 01:04 PM
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Thank you AkG for your support, I really appreciate it. I did offer to settle the issue with a $10 partial refund a few days ago, I would also settle for $5 if he just admits it instead of having this time consuming debate. When he gave me the package, he had clearly opened it before because there were unboxing crevices. The transparent sticker was still intact on the base. I just realized that it may be a possibility that he opened it, noticed the defective base, and decided to sell it instead of dealing with cross-border rma, though I don't think and hope that's not the case. What matters is how it's advertised, not the price. It was advertised BNIB at $55, and I agreed to pay the asking $55 for a BNIB mega. Even if it was $10, I still expect it to be in perfect and new condition, nothing more and nothing less, no different if it was $55 or $80. AkG is right, just because it doesn't impact performance doesn't mean that there are no problems.
  #34 (permalink)  
Old August 28, 2010, 01:43 PM
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Obviously he opened the box itself. Did you not see these? http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4135/...30af30623e.jpg http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4074/...50aa9eb10c.jpg On a side note you better not shop for any expansion cards at the local PC shop here, oh no, they open the boxes to look at the chipsets for customers that actually care! o.o shocking

0o0, really, it was exactly as advertised. Nowhere did he say was that it was 100% perfect with no even slight blemishes or even so much as skin oils. That is an unreasonable promise or expectation.

BNIB does not equal perfect; all it means is that the product is new and unused and in the original box (without abuse of course, and this is not abuse). People expecting perfection are making unreasonable expectations. And no, I am not out of line saying that.
Also, new does not equal perfect either, nor does "right off the assembly line/out of the factory"


You know what? my PC's case has overspray on a few parts of the inside, I should go knocking on NCIX's door and tell them that they need compensate me. OMG LINUS U SCREWED ME!
And ICDiamond dudes, you made my CPU's IHS and my cooler's base way daaarrkk! bitches stained mah shit! New PhenomX4+HSF plzkthx.
( NCIX, CoolerMaster and IC dudes(that make crazy thermal compound) are directed to ignore the above two lines, you guys are not at fault and all my shizt still works great and you guys are great. <3 )
  #35 (permalink)  
Old August 28, 2010, 02:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MacJunky View Post
Obviously he opened the box itself. Did you not see these? http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4135/...30af30623e.jpg http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4074/...50aa9eb10c.jpg On a side note you better not shop for any expansion cards at the local PC shop here, oh no, they open the boxes to look at the chipsets for customers that actually care! o.o shocking

0o0, really, it was exactly as advertised. Nowhere did he say was that it was 100% perfect with no even slight blemishes or even so much as skin oils. That is an unreasonable promise or expectation.

BNIB does not equal perfect; all it means is that the product is new and unused and in the original box (without abuse of course, and this is not abuse). People expecting perfection are making unreasonable expectations. And no, I am not out of line saying that.
Also, new does not equal perfect either, nor does "right off the assembly line/out of the factory"


You know what? my PC's case has overspray on a few parts of the inside, I should go knocking on NCIX's door and tell them that they need compensate me. OMG LINUS U SCREWED ME!
And ICDiamond dudes, you made my CPU's IHS and my cooler's base way daaarrkk! bitches stained mah shit! New PhenomX4+HSF plzkthx.
( NCIX, CoolerMaster and IC dudes(that make crazy thermal compound) are directed to ignore the above two lines, you guys are not at fault and all my shizt still works great and you guys are great. <3 )

Actually that is a perfectly reasonable expectation. That is what New means. New means its in 100% original factory condition. You dont buy a new car with defects in the paint job. You dont buy a new subway sandwhich with a bite out of it. AND if you do you bring it back and they replace it while apologizing for the mishap. Stating otherwise is being disingenuous. But other than that....good going for trying to keep the discussion on topic and at a mature level.
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  #36 (permalink)  
Old August 28, 2010, 02:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AkG View Post
New means its in 100% original factory condition.
So you think it was used first and then sold?

When I got my Logitech G110 a month or two ago from one of NCIX's sales I opened it, and there was a smudge on the hand rest as if someone had been resting their hand on it. I wiped it off and made sure there were no real problem with the KB and carried on. I didn't ask NCIX for $5 back...

I can't say if this cooler was unused or not though since I'm not the seller or buyer.
  #37 (permalink)  
Old August 28, 2010, 02:33 PM
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So you seriously take a car back because one side of the undercoating was a grey instead of black like the other side? Or because someone put a dab of green paint on the underside of the floor pans? (your botched paintjob one was too extreme, and the food one was not related at all)

This is not visible unless you remove the heatsink and clean it properly.(something 0o0 has already failed to do, actually..)
This is not affecting the performance.
The rest of the heatsink is fine wrt finish as well as physically.
At best he might be able to get away saying that it is 99.9% instead of 100%.

But you know what? That heatsink came from the factory like that so "new 100% original factory condition" is what he has.

I do not send an HDD back because the sticker was not completely straight. That mis-aligned sticker is new 100% factory condition and it is purely cosmetic, just like his cooler.

Quote:
Originally Posted by headsh0t View Post
I can't say if this cooler was unused or not though since I'm not the seller or buyer.
I recall hearing somewhere, true or not, that the backplate was still sealed... soo. *shrug*
  #38 (permalink)  
Old August 28, 2010, 02:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MacJunky View Post
So you seriously take a car back because one side of the undercoating was a grey instead of black like the other side? Or because someone put a dab of green paint on the underside of the floor pans? (your botched paintjob one was too extreme, and the food one was not related at all)

This is not visible unless you remove the heatsink and clean it properly.(something 0o0 has already failed to do, actually..)
This is not affecting the performance.
The rest of the heatsink is fine wrt finish as well as physically.
At best he might be able to get away saying that it is 99.9% instead of 100%.

But you know what? That heatsink came from the factory like that so "new 100% original factory condition" is what he has.

I do not send an HDD back because the sticker was not completely straight. That mis-aligned sticker is new 100% factory condition and it is purely cosmetic, just like his cooler.


I recall hearing somewhere, true or not, that the backplate was still sealed... soo. *shrug*
For someone who is (or should be) a disinterested 3rd party you sure are arguing both sides of the coin extremely hard. One moment its "its not opened how do you expect him to know the condition" the next its "he opened it to check the condition". So which was it. What did your friend do? Was it unopened or was it opened. You cant have it both ways.

As for your arguments, IF you buy a new car and the paint job is not PERFECT then yes you are well within your rights to bring it back. That is the real world. Unlike what you stated previously, the customer IS always right. Even if he is wrong. You try to accommodate him. You dont call him names, insuinuate he is an idiot or anything of similar ilk.

No this cooler was not in 100% Factory condition as even if it left the factory like this is does not meet Prolimatech's standards. That is unless you are saying ALL Prolimatech's come with major or minor imperfections? Is that what you are trying to argue?

As for your hard drive analogy. No not over a sticker but if the SATA ports were discolored or there was a ding in the housing then yes. It wouldnt be in perfect condition.

I honestly thought you were trying to have a genuine serious conversation. Obviously I was wrong. So this is my last post in this thread. Once again the IRC crowd drag another thread down into the gutter when others with dissenting opinions voice their opinion. Great going guys. Keep up that great "team IRC" spirit. Afterall thats whats "really" important.


Quote:
Originally Posted by headsh0t View Post
So you think it was used first and then sold?

When I got my Logitech G110 a month or two ago from one of NCIX's sales I opened it, and there was a smudge on the hand rest as if someone had been resting their hand on it. I wiped it off and made sure there were no real problem with the KB and carried on. I didn't ask NCIX for $5 back...

I can't say if this cooler was unused or not though since I'm not the seller or buyer.
Nope. I dont. My best guess is it was just improperly stored either before or after crossfire got it. Personally, I dont think it matters one way or the other. He sold it as being in NEW condition. It was not. That is a simple fact. You could argue it was 99.99999999999% and it wouldnt matter it was sold based on false advertising. Most likely inadvertent false advertising as Im sure crossfire would never do that. But still false. Everything else is just dross.

Hopefully him and 0o0 can come to some accommodation that doesn't involve implying o0o is an idiot, or o0o implying crossfire is dishonest. Not a mod, have no inisder information. Just simply a disinterested 3rd party who didnt like the way crossfire's IRC buddies were treating o0o.
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  #39 (permalink)  
Old August 28, 2010, 02:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MacJunky View Post
So you seriously take a car back because one side of the undercoating was a grey instead of black like the other side? Or because someone put a dab of green paint on the underside of the floor pans? (your botched paintjob one was too extreme, and the food one was not related at all)

This is not visible unless you remove the heatsink and clean it properly.(something 0o0 has already failed to do, actually..)
This is not affecting the performance.
The rest of the heatsink is fine wrt finish as well as physically.
At best he might be able to get away saying that it is 99.9% instead of 100%.

But you know what? That heatsink came from the factory like that so "new 100% original factory condition" is what he has.

I do not send an HDD back because the sticker was not completely straight. That mis-aligned sticker is new 100% factory condition and it is purely cosmetic, just like his cooler.


I recall hearing somewhere, true or not, that the backplate was still sealed... soo. *shrug*
You really think that 3 passes of 70% alcohol and 1 generous pass of arcticlean 1/2 is not enough? What would you recommend then? Cleaning your g110 is very different, it's fix-able where as this problem with the base can't be fixed. Uneven coating inside a case is completely normal, I get it with all my cases and I've never complained because that's an effect of the manufacturing (painting) method and all cases are supposed to come like that. OTOH heatsink bases aren't supposed to come this messy. I really don't understand why it's so difficult to admit that there is definitely something wrong with the base and that crossfire should offer some sort of resolution or compensation to it.
  #40 (permalink)  
Old August 28, 2010, 03:00 PM
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ive dealth with both if memory serves right, and they both seem ok people. cross's got a bit of bad luck with sales lately, but i dont think this should affect his long term commitment here, or elsewhere. hes probably learned to put some doubt where it needs to be

i.e. box is unopened? brand new in box. box opened? you say if you see something amiss or 'i think everything is ok but then again i can be blind sometimes' :)

and thats it.

back on topic, this i think is one of the few times i hear about issues with proligma units. they seem to have decently high standards in terms of qc and the such.
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