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Old January 29, 2012, 12:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Desiato View Post
I don't ignore your claim; I dispute that consoles hold back PC gaming. Games like Mass Effect and Skyrim have extremely large budgets that are made possible by the large number of console gamers. They exist as they do because of the large console gaming market.

Modern games require extremely large budgets to develop high detail content. Increasing the level of detail not only requires more people (coders, artists, management, support), but also new hardware, software and infrastructure. There are also very big training and scaling challenges across the board.

So it's impossible to imagine what Skyrim and Mass Effect would be without the market muscle of console gamers funding them. If they had greater detail, there would be significantly less content. In any case, they would probably be completely different.

I'm speaking generally. There are obvious exceptions such as Blizzard. But PC gaming has never been large enough to support dozens of Blizzards. Even Blizzard releases games with very moderate specs which aren't showcases of PC power.

The truth is, PC gaming is held back by its inherent flaws which make it too inconvenient and expensive for most users and publishers. Therefore the market is relatively small, catering primarily to niche communities and genres that don't work well on consoles. Eventually, most of the best PC Dev teams simply outgrow the market.
I bolded the part that is just not true. For example you are creating textures for X game, you have a choice of creating them at 4096x4096 or 512x512. Since you are making it for a console you choose 512x512. Now when it ports to PC it is way lower than it could be. If you had just done it at the larger size it would only need to be scaled down for the lesser consoles. Not only would this increase the visual quality of the game on a PC, but most likely on the console as well. Will this take more time? Maybe slightly as yes your artist may have to put in slightly more fine details, but you are not going to be hiring other people or needing better infrastructure.

I'm not discounting the effect the consoles have had on gaming in general, and like you say they are allowing some of the bigger budgets that we might not see otherwise, but that is not an excuse for forcing crappy ports down the necks of PC gamers. You can still make a cross platform game and I really have no issue with that, but you should be developing for the highest end system you can. You can always scale down but you can't scale up to the same degree. Frankly I would be extremely surprised if you did not see much better console games as a result.

Now how this pertains to the topic of this thread? The card getting put into the 720 (if this rumor is right) is already outdated. Yes if it was released today and has the low level access, then it could seriously compete with high end rigs, but by the time it does get released we here in the PC world will have the next two generations of GPUs out and will be leaving it in the dust. Remember when back in the day a new generation of consoles would come out and they would be better than a top end PC. Then PCs would start gaining ground and passing them only to have another console generation come out that passed it. Yet with this GPU in the 720 it will not be up with the high ends, but down with the low-mid end. Now from all standpoints this should not be acceptable to anyone. I know if I was an xbox person I would be annoyed knowing that my brand new console will not look as good and my friends computer he built months before.
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